Leslie Odom Jr film controversy

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 12:25pm

Anybody see the drama over Sia's film that stars Leslie Odom Jr? As somebody on the spectrum , It doesn't bother me much that she cast Maddie Ziegler as a young autistic woman (Look at Freddie Highmore on the Good Doctor . He does such a good portrayal ) but her tweets to autistic actors and her statement on why she didn't cast somebody on the spectrum disgust me .....

[HogansHero]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 1:02pm

am I missing something or have you buried the lede and in doing so unfairly tarnished LOJ?

[James885]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 1:15pm

Is that the girl from that awful Dance Moms show? Can she even act? I think there's a big difference between her and an actor like Freddie Highmore who actually has the chops to bring out the nuances of portraying someone who's autistic.

That aside, the dance portions of the trailer with Leslie Odom Jr look okay but the rest looks pretty meh. Also I love how Sia defended herself by claiming she consulted with Autism Speaks while working on the film. Autism Speaks is a generally horrid organization that is rife with controversy. 

Updated On: 11/21/20 at 01:15 PM

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 1:22pm

For a summation: https://ew.com/movies/sia-music-movie-autism-controversy/

(It's a mess, Sia's terrible, and I mostly feel bad for LOJ's twitter mentions right now. Stop replying all when you don't have to, people!)

[Fosse76]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 1:24pm

She said the girl she originally cast was too overwhelmed being on set. The complaint by some others to simply accommodate the girl by making changes to the set are clearly from people who have never been on a movie set before. There is only so much that can be done to reasonably accommodate someone with those kinds of needs. So the idea that autistic characters should only be played by autistic actors is ridiculous.

But her response to that particular criticism is pretty tone deaf. Instead of explaining that it's too costly and impractical to make the accommodation that this particular actress needed, she writes on an off-the-wall rant about hiring prostitutes and trans people to play doctors. As if that's comparable.

[binau]

Posted: 11/21/20 at 1:31pm

Within the trashy pop music world Sia is Sondheim as a writer and Bernadette Peters as a singer. As far as I'm concerned, she is a genius. The 1 minute trailer looks incredible and I am glad that Sia has been able to showcase and tell the story of a character with autism on a major stage. This is rare, and although perhaps a missed opportunity RE: actor of choice still something to be celebrated in my opinion. 

Unfortunately, Sia suffers openly from a myriad of emotional problems herself and you are unlikely going to get a PR filtered response. I would suggest if people have an issue with her or her movie just boycott it and move on. 

Updated On: 11/21/20 at 01:31 PM

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 2/13/21 at 10:33pm

As somebody on the spectrum, hearing more and more about this film makes me sick. Apparently the autistic character is supposed to be biracial and they blackfaced Maddie Ziegler. There was also violent scenes of restraint and jokes that austism is a "curse" in Ghana. Anybody see this film at all?

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 2/13/21 at 10:40pm

Yeah....when two grown adults are violently restraining/borderline abusing a child who is supposed to be autistic....I turned it off. This film shouldn't exist, no wondered it was shelved for years. 

[AllThatJazz2]

Posted: 2/14/21 at 10:40am

MannPhan24601 said: "As somebody on the spectrum, hearing more and more about this film makes me sick. Apparently the autistic character is supposed to be biracial and they blackfaced Maddie Ziegler. There was also violent scenes of restraint and jokes that austism is a "curse" in Ghana. Anybody see this film at all?"

Another autistic here who is sickened by this film's existence. Multiple autistic activists/self-advocates have already watched and given detailed recaps, complete with image stills and full clips, and what I've seen is more than enough that I will never, ever subject myself to watching it in full. It's a beyond offensive caricature depiction of an autistic person, and the use of prone restraint as depicted in the film has gotten autistics killed in the past - and despite Sia claiming she was going to remove the restraint scenes and add a disclaimer, neither of those actions have been taken at this point. Even without those scenes, the film is a slap in the face. This film is insulting and sincerely damaging to the autistic community, and I am so deeply disappointed people like Leslie Odom Jr. and Kate Hudson are associated with it. My greatest hope is that this film quickly fades from existence and winds up in the bargain bin. 

[binau]

Posted: 2/14/21 at 11:36am

I suspect the movie will either be quickly forgotten or notoriously remembered in 'worst of all time' lists judging on the reception from critics & audiences. I still want to try and check it out to see if there are salvageable moments though - I am enjoying the soundtrack. 

Updated On: 2/14/21 at 11:36 AM

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 9:50am

I'm so disgusted and will probably need to talk about this with my therapist. Leslie grew up in the Philly area and I've always admired him and was hoping to see him in concert  at my favorite venue before the pandemic hit https://metro.co.uk/2021/01/19/leslie-odom-jr-responds-music-backlash-supports-visionary-sia-13932106/

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 10:49am

I have a cousin and nephew with autism. I saw the trailer and was absolutely disgusted. This unfortunately has been nominated for Best Picture at the Golden Globes and booted Meryl Streep out of the running with Kate Hudson’s inclusion in Best Actress. To think this will have any kind of legacy because of the HFPA wanting to nominate something the public hadn’t seen yet is sad and vile.

[JSquared2]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 12:11pm

MannPhan24601 said: "I'm so disgusted and will probably need to talk about this with my therapist. 

OFFS

 

[Fosse76]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 2:25pm

MannPhan24601 said: "I'm so disgusted and will probably need to talk about this with my therapist. Leslie grew up in the Philly area and I've always admired him and was hoping to see him in concert at my favorite venue before the pandemic hithttps://metro.co.uk/2021/01/19/leslie-odom-jr-responds-music-backlash-supports-visionary-sia-13932106/"

I find his response as pretty tone deaf, particularly since he pretty much accuses the criticism being from people who haven't seen the film. Aside from criticism by some of the casting of Maddie Zeigler, actual criticism of the film itself has been made by people who have seen it,  and I haven't heard anyone call it a good movie.  And did he really compare Sia to David Bowie?

[JBroadway]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 3:07pm

Fosse76 said: "MannPhan24601 said: "

I find his response as pretty tone deaf, particularly since he pretty much accuses the criticism being from people who haven't seen the film. Aside from criticism by some of the casting of Maddie Zeigler, actual criticism of the film itself has been made by people who have seen it, and I haven't heard anyone call it a good movie." 

That was my thought at well. His response might have been semi-reasonable if the movie still hadn't come out. But now it has. If his ears are as open as he says, how has he not heard the criticisms of the actual movie itself? Feels like an evasive non-answer. But maybe it's unfair to expect anything different from an actor doing press for a project. I'm not sure how these things work, but is he under contract to promote the movie? If so, he might've been in breach of contract if he spoke out. A part of me feels like the press needs to stop asking actors to respond to controversy around projects they're currently promoting - regardless of whether they're contractually obligated to say nice things. It's just setting everybody up for pain and disappointment (I have mixed feelings about this, because I can see a valid argument for the opposite too - it's complicated).

 

 

 

[Tag]

Posted: 2/17/21 at 7:57pm

JBroadway said: "That was my thought at well. His response might have been semi-reasonable if the movie still hadn't come out. But now it has. If his ears are as open as he says, how has he not heard the criticisms of the actual movie itself? Feels like an evasive non-answer. But maybe it's unfair to expect anything different from an actor doing press for a project. I'm not sure how these things work, but is he under contract to promote the movie? If so, he might've been in breach of contract if he spoke out. Apart of me feels like the pressneeds to stop asking actors to respond to controversy around projects they're currently promoting - regardless of whether they're contractually obligated tosay nice things. It's just setting everybody up for pain and disappointment(I have mixed feelings about this, because I can see a validargument for the opposite too - it's complicated)."

His response is from an article released in mid-January.  So most people, if any, hadn't seen the film yet.

 

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 9:05am

I think Leslie's responses are appropriate since the film wasn't released. He is saying that the project was made with good intentions and artists can't anticipate how it will land or be received. He is open to reactions and dialogue-good and bad once someone sees it. 

Sia is a genius. He actually worked with her so he is entitled to compare her to another legend. He chose Bowie. Ask any artist who works with her and they are blown away by her process. If she is not your cup of tea, fine, but that doesn't make her any less extraordinary. 

I imagine the film was not designed to tell everyone's story. If it allows people, especially younger people, to develop more empathy and understanding for someone who operates differently, then great. If it is a total turkey, it will fade into obscurity. However, I am sure the film will become a favorite of many young people for varying reasons. We all have sentimental favorite films that were bombs. It looks creative and colorful. 

As a gay man, I grew up on a steady diet of offensive film portrayals but was able to glean insights from them. They didn't destroy me or the gay movement. I took what I could and moved on. Gay men were never played by gay men, certainly not out gay men. I'm sure there will be strengths and criticisms of Maddie's portrayal. 

 

[JBroadway]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 9:30am

Tag said: "His response is from an article released in mid-January. So most people, if any, hadn't seen the film yet."

 

Thanks for the correction!

 

[Fosse76]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 11:42am

Tag said: "His response is from an article released in mid-January. So most people, if any, hadn't seen the film yet."

Except that many industry folk had seen the film in January.  But much of the criticism at the time was in response to the casting of Maggie Zeigler. Especially since Sia had fired the auditable actress she originally hired. So his claims aren't accurate. 

[Fosse76]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 12:09pm

Bettyboy72 said: "I think Leslie's responses are appropriate since the film wasn't released. He is saying that the project was made with good intentions and artists can't anticipate how it will land or be received. He is open to reactions and dialogue-good and bad once someone sees it."

Good intentiions are irrelevant. Can you imagine that as the excuse for using blackface? Plus he's being disingenuous.  Industry folk were already setting the film,  but most of the vocal criticism at the time was in response to the casting of Maddie Zeigler. 

"Sia is a genius. He actually worked with her so he is entitled to compare her to another legend. He chose Bowie. Ask any artist who works with her and they are blown away by her process. If she is not your cup of tea, fine, but that doesn't make her any less extraordinary."

He's only entitled to compare her to other people he's worked with (in that respect). He's never worked with Bowie,  so he had no point of comparison. And if she's a genius she wouldn't have made a universally panned movie (by both critics and audiences).

"I imagine the film was not designed to tell everyone's story. If it allows people, especially younger people, to develop more empathy and understanding for someone who operates differently, then great. If it is a total turkey, it will fade into obscurity. However, I am sure the film will become a favorite of many young people for varying reasons. We all have sentimental favorite films that were bombs. It looks creative and colorful."

Are you an investor in the movie? Not only is the film universally panned by both critics and audiences, it has been described as deeply offensive. 

"As a gay man, I grew up on a steady diet of offensive film portrayals but was able to glean insights from them. They didn't destroy me or the gay movement. I took what I could and moved on. Gay men were never played by gay men, certainly not out gay men. I'm sure there will be strengths and criticisms of Maddie's portrayal."

Apples and oranges. There is no reason, in this day and age, for such an inflammatory portrayal of a condition or lifestyle, so Sia has no excuse. The idea that only gay characters should be played by gay individuals is ridiculous (and if that's what you are arguing, then you can't complain when gay actors are overlooked for straight characters). And I am not against able-bodied performers passing characters with disabilities. But Maddie is no actress. and the reviews have not been kind. 

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 1:26pm

Plus he's being disingenuous.

Shocking.

There is no reason, in this day and age, for such an inflammatory portrayal of a condition or lifestyle, so Sia has no excuse. The idea that only gay characters should be played by gay individuals is ridiculous (and if that's what you are arguing, then you can't complain when gay actors are overlooked for straight characters). And I am not against able-bodied performers passing characters with disabilities. But Maddie is no actress. and the reviews have not been kind.

All of this. Great comments. 

 

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 2/19/21 at 8:40pm

Well I found the film last night for free on 123Movies and it SUCKED. At the beginning, Ziegler's character actually could talk and was able to walk around town independently . It seemed like once Zu got custody of her, she started getting dumbed  down. Also, LOJ's character was from Africa and had AIDS(Very stereotypical) . Besides the restraint scenes, there was also a scene on where LOJ's character's boxing student was killed by his father and had nothing really to do with the plot then it turned into this weird song with the grandmother who died at the beginning and what I assume was Music and Zu's mother being sung by Zu/Kate Hudson. 

The scene that got me really confused was when Sia made a cameo herself(I thought she never shows her face in public anymore and she did here and at least one virtual interview about this film) . She claimed she was buying heavy illegal  drugs from Zu to  "send to Haiti". wtf was that about????

 

Also, Sia said in a interview back in 2015 when it was in development that she wrote the film for Maddie. She never had a autistic  actor lined up. Freddy Highmore's performance on The Good Doctor is brilliant. Her casting a neurotypical didn't bother me. It was just on how she reacted on how autistic's "can't act" on twitter and clearly didn't consult with the community besides her one friend from rehab. Somebody on one of the fb groups I'm on said that Sia has the same autoimmune disease she has and that when fans go to her concerts asking for their canes and walkers to be signed at events , she refuses. The only thing I liked about the film was that 1+1 dream sequence . and there was also blackface as music was supposed to be "biracial".............

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 2/20/21 at 8:15pm

Well Kate Hudson had a much better response https://www.vulture.com/2021/02/watch-kate-hudson-responds-to-backlash-to-sias-music.html?utm_source=undefined&utm_medium=undefined&utm_campaign=feed-part EDIT: I know it wasn't perfect but she had a better statement than LOJ. At least she actually mentioned the backlash specifically when asked.

Updated On: 2/20/21 at 08:15 PM

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 2/20/21 at 10:55pm

On the private Actors Equity page on Fb there is a particular person who keeps dragging Sia for the casting and I’m happy to see you all are on the same page. Let actors act. I don’t know anything else about the film. But do enjoy the Sia album released with the movie.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 2/20/21 at 11:06pm

I agree: Let actors with autism act.