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Darren Aronofsky Is Adapting Samuel D. Hunter's "THE WHALE" For Film- Page 2

SouthernCakes
Broadway Legend
joined:7/29/19
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/29/19

JBroadway said: "What part of this argument are you confused about? The age-old "acting is acting" excuseis a straw-man's argument thathas been addressed time and time again, year after year, thread after thread. Rebuttalshave already been written in this thread, by me and others.

It's not "if you haven't lived it, you can't portray it." That's a blanket statement that no one is actually advocating for. Another straw-man. But there are SOMEmarginalized groups that simply cannot be played respectfully or authentically by people of other groups.

Now, I'll admit - I don't necessarily know if I'd say that obese people are one of these groups (I'm open to hear arguments either way). However, that's not the only thing that's at play here. There's also the issue of jobs for actors within those marginalized groups, which I discussed in detail in my last post (please see above).Every time I hear the "acting is acting" complaint, it'sfrom people who seem to conveniently ignore this pivotal side of the argument.

Also, I'd love to hear an example of how this mentality has actually harmed the arts in real life. And even if it hasharmed the arts, is that a more pressing issue than advocating for respectand job availability for marginalized people?


"

You just keep throwing the same words around trying to make a point. No one was up in arms when a non-600lb man played the part at Playwrights. I saw the show and loved it. I don’t see the issue now. It’s acting. 
 

Updated On: 1/13/21 at 10:50 AM
Kad Profile Photo
Kad
Broadway Legend
joined:11/5/05
Broadway Legend | Joined: 11/5/05
I think the questions of “are there any actors who are morbidly obese to the point of immobilization, as is depicted in the text?” and “if so, would they be able to safely take on a starring role in a motion picture?” are pertinent here.

Disability representation is important, and disabled actors should - whenever actually possible- be the ones telling their own stories. But every instance is unique. There may be situations - and this may be one- in which it cannot be done.
"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."
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JBroadway
Broadway Legend
joined:4/6/12
Broadway Legend | Joined: 4/6/12
Funny that you say that, because on my end it seems like that’s what you’re doing. Obviously we’re not on the same page here. No snark: I would genuinely like to know what about my posts comes across as “throwing around words trying to make a point.” Because from my perspective, I feel like I made a pretty logical and thoroughly-explained point. Obvious something isn’t translating.

Things have changed since 2014, though I don’t think people are up in arms about this particular case, so much as we’re just looking for ways to be better, and arguing with those who say that there’s no way to cast a fat person in this role. The thing I’m more “up in arms” about personally is the use of the old “acting is acting” argument, for the reasons I explained in my last post (though again, it something wasn’t clear about it, I’d be happy to clarify)
Kad Profile Photo
Kad
Broadway Legend
joined:11/5/05
Broadway Legend | Joined: 11/5/05
Again, this is not just a “fat” role. There are certainly many overweight actors. Even if an actor who was merely overweight played this, they would still need a substantial amount of makeup / padding to appear as morbidly obese as the character is written. And frankly, that seems just as problematic, implicitly saying that the only thing separating an otherwise healthy overweight person from someone who is immobilized and chronically ill is a bit of padding.
"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."
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JBroadway
Broadway Legend
joined:4/6/12
Broadway Legend | Joined: 4/6/12
@Kad - that’s an interesting point. I hadn’t thought of it from that angle.
Sutton Ross Profile Photo
Sutton Ross
Broadway Legend
joined:7/20/13
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/20/13

"This point has already been addressed."

Yet, they still get to have an opinion about it. 

 

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darquegk
Broadway Legend
joined:2/5/09
Broadway Legend | Joined: 2/5/09

I mean, Fraser isn't gay either, but the question of whether that sort of casting is appropriate or not comes up already approximately once a week anyway. Is it the same question? A different one? Who knows at this point.

ViniFromBrazil
Understudy
joined:1/26/16
Understudy | Joined: 1/26/16
blaxx said: "ViniFromBrazil said: "omg you guys find ways to fight in every damn post, don't you"

Now imagine how marginalized performers feel like.
"



My point is the constant fighting and bickering. I am a black marginalized civilian, assumptions aside.

SouthernCakes
Broadway Legend
joined:7/29/19
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/29/19
I get representation! But as a gay man, I don’t need every gay role to be played by a gay man because then that puts us (actors) in a weird position of never being able to play outside of our own circumstances, which is boring.
ArtMan
Broadway Legend
joined:9/10/08
Broadway Legend | Joined: 9/10/08

Slightly off topic.  Just wanted to mention how great Darlene Cates was in What's Eating Gilbert Grape.  If you haven't seen it...it's a Johnny Depp/Leonardo Dicaprio  film.  Darlene plays their heavily obese mother and she's terrific.  I couldn't picture anyone else in the role.

FindingNamo
Broadway Legend
joined:7/22/03
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/22/03

I've seen.a few Falstaffs in my time who were really big and not padded and jeez, if they could position cameras in such a way that Philip Seymour Hoffman could play pint-size pepper pot Truman Capote, then I think they could pull this off without padding. If they wanted to,. 

Maybe they could borrow "Come Look At The Freaks" from Side Show?

Can you hear me now? Twit: @NamoInExile
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darquegk
Broadway Legend
joined:2/5/09
Broadway Legend | Joined: 2/5/09
I was going to say “is John Goodman too old for the role?” Then I googled him and discovered that he’s somewhat gaunt these days. I think I remember him much larger than he ever was because of his role as the gluttonous one-eyed man in “O Brother,” where he is shot to look somewhat gigantic.
FindingNamo
Broadway Legend
joined:7/22/03
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/22/03

Let's also acknowledge that this is one of a handful of topics that's a friggin minefield! Complicated issues are... as the kids used to say... complicated.  I think it's worth talking about and not dismiss it as bickering.  I too, thought of the Gilbert Grape mother. Was she nominated for an Oscar for that? 

Look what a minefield of a professional life Gabourey Sidibe's career has been. Look at the crap Lizzo gets. I don't think it comes down to us as individuals having "a problem with" the casting of whatever identity/type we get to say "As a" before we throw in our two cents.  I think the two cents are all worth it. I don't know if we'll ever arrive at "the answer" because I don't think there is just one.

 

Can you hear me now? Twit: @NamoInExile
AEA AGMA SM
Broadway Legend
joined:8/13/09
Broadway Legend | Joined: 8/13/09
FindingNamo said: "Let's also acknowledge that this is one of a handful of topics that's a friggin minefield! Complicated issues are... as the kids used to say... complicated. I think it's worth talking about and not dismiss it as bickering. I too, thought of the Gilbert Grape mother. Was she nominated for an Oscar for that?

Look what a minefield of a professionallife Gabourey Sidibe's career has been. Look at the crap Lizzo gets. I don't think it comes down to us as individuals having "a problem with" the casting of whatever identity/type we get to say "As a" before we throw in our two cents. I think the two cents are all worth it. I don't know if we'll ever arrive at "the answer" because I don't think there is just one.

"



Unfortunately DiCaprio as supporting actor was the only nomination the film received at both the Oscars and the Golden Globes. Cates had never acted before and was apparently discovered through on an episode of Sally Jessy Raphael about morbidly obese people.

Did you know that every day Mexican gays cross our borders and unplug our brain-dead ladies?
SouthernCakes
Broadway Legend
joined:7/29/19
Broadway Legend | Joined: 7/29/19
I just get afraid of straying from letting actors act.
Kad Profile Photo
Kad
Broadway Legend
joined:11/5/05
Broadway Legend | Joined: 11/5/05

SouthernCakes said: "I just get afraid of straying from letting actors act.
"

There are many more legitimate things to be afraid of.

"...everyone finally shut up, and the audience could enjoy the beginning of the Anatevka Pogram in peace."
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thommg
Stand-by
joined:7/23/03
Stand-by | Joined: 7/23/03

Perhaps the screenplay has scenes involving Brendan Fraser where he is not yet a 600 pound man. Perhaps there are scenes that show growing into being a 600 pound man. I doubt this will take place in a living room as the play does. I am reserving my judgement until I see the film.

LightsOut90
Broadway Legend
joined:5/2/14
Broadway Legend | Joined: 5/2/14
^ the film script apparently shifts in time quiet a bit

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