Who you like 2020 Dems- Page 18

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 9:40am

Uncle Charlie - will not get very longer winded in replying to you. I will just say in 2016 Biden would have kicked Trump's butt in election, 2020 not so much. If you think Biden is ok and not going senile than that is fine with me. I just think Biden being POTUS in his 80's is scary thought, hope he picks a good VP candidate. Just wondering, are you curious why Biden wants to be able to sit at next debate?

As for being a "Trumpster", that is pretty funny because you have no idea how I voted in 2016. You can obviously tell from my posts that I am not exactly a big liberal but that does not make everyone a "Trumpster". There were quite a few people on conservative side that did not vote for or like Trump very much. So, please don't assume I am a "Trumpster"

[Highland Guy]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 10:06am

Today's primaries/caucuses (with number of delegates):

Idaho (20)

Michigan (125)

Mississippi (36)

Missouri (68)

North Dakota (14)

Washington State (89)

 

VOTE  BLUE  !!

[UncleCharlie]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 3:07pm

yankeefan7 said: "Uncle Charlie - will not get very longer winded in replying to you. I will just say in 2016 Biden would have kicked Trump's butt in election, 2020 not so much. Ifyou think Biden is ok and not going senile than that is fine with me. I just think Biden being POTUS in his 80's is scary thought, hope he picks a good VP candidate. Just wondering, are you curious why Biden wants to be able to sit at next debate?

As for being a "Trumpster", that is pretty funny because you have no idea how I voted in 2016. You can obviously tell from my posts that I am not exactly a big liberal but that does not make everyone a "Trumpster". There were quite a few people on conservative side that did not vote for or like Trump very much. So, please don't assume I am a "Trumpster""

There's a huge difference between occasional bouts of forgetfulness and being senile. Unless you're a medical doctor who's performed cognitive tests on Biden, you really need to stop throwing that word around cause you have absolutely no idea. Biden released his full medical records in December and his doctor, who was his White House doctor when he was V.P. pronounced him fit to serve as president. And you keep conveniently ignoring the fact that Trump frequently misuses words or just creates words that don't exist and then tries to convince everybody what he said was exactly what he meant to say. Biden will be surrounded by the best people, not sycophants who are afraid to ever disagree with him cause they've seen those that do are fired by tweet the next day. Frankly, I'm a lot less worried that Biden will be wandering around the White House at 3 in the morning looking for the doorknob to open the pantry to get a snack and accidently push the nuclear button than I am about Trump declaring war on France cause Macron teased him about something.

And you're right, I don't know how you voted in 2016 but your comments on this board have been supportive of Trump and you parrot the typical talking points Trump supporters use (trying to advance the narrative that Biden is becoming senile as an example) so guess what... that makes you a Trumpster. It's not a derogatory term like Trumptard, MAGAt or right wing nut job, it just describes someone who expresses support for Trump. Rather than being coy and telling me I shouldn't assume, you can be clear where you stand and who you are hoping wins in November. Of course, you have no obligation to do so, but regardless of where you see yourself on the political spectrum, until you say you're not a Trump supporter and don't plan to vote for him in November, I will fall back to my conclusion based on your comments on this board that indicate you support his re-election. I welcome you to prove me wrong.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 6:58pm

"There's a huge difference between occasional bouts of forgetfulness and being senile. Unless you're a medical doctor who's performed cognitive tests on Biden, you really need to stop throwing that word around cause you have absolutely no idea."

You are absolutely right I am not a doctor but I think it is more than Republicans or Trumpsters who think Biden has issues. How come Biden's handlers want his speeches to only be 7-10 minutes long? Have you watch Biden in some of the debates? It looks like at times he is struggling to complete a thought or sentence. You want to live in fantasy island IMO and think this is Joe just being Joe and laugh it off, fine with me. BTW - I don't know how old you are but Democrats and the media had no problem attacking Reagan and saying he was going senile until he crushed that issue with humor in debate with Mondale in 1984. 

" Frankly, I'm a lot less worried that Biden will be wandering around the White House at 3 in the morning looking for the doorknob to open the pantry to get a snack and accidently push the nuclear button than I am about Trump declaring war on France cause Macron teased him about something."

Trump has been POTUS almost 4 years and has been teased by foreign leaders, no wars yet.

"Of course, you have no obligation to do so, but regardless of where you see yourself on the political spectrum, until you say you're not a Trump supporter and don't plan to vote for him in November, I will fall back to my conclusion based on your comments on this board that indicate you support his re-election. I welcome you to prove me wrong."

Let me get to the point. My choice on the Democratic side is going to be a socialist/communist who has achieved nothing in the US Senate for decades or a man I believe is going senile. You think he is fine so we will agree to disagree. Then we have Trump who makes me cringe at time with his tweets and personal attacks. That being said, on his watch the economy has been pretty good. So do I waste my vote and vote third party or do I pick the "best" of three evils. In the world of sports, we call this a game time decision -lol.

[Highland Guy]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 7:06pm

Both Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders have cancelled rallies tonight because of concerns about the coronavirus.  Good decision.

[Highland Guy]

Posted: 3/10/20 at 7:40pm

And now, at the next debate, there won't be an audience.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 9:34am

"And now, at the next debate, there won't be an audience."

That actually will be a good idea. I think it is over for Bernie unless Biden really struggles in two man debate, we shall see.

[BenElliott]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 11:42am

I'm 100% team Bernie. I also loved Warren. I think we need to start looking toward the future and thinking about the future generations. The majority of modern college students are leaving school with student loans in the $30,000-$100,000. How do we expect for this country to thrive if the younger generations are so deep in debt? You could easily raise taxes on the extremely wealthy by just a smidge and erase that financial prison from a lot of people.

Also, we NEED Medicare for all. Every other major country has it except us. Medicine is too expensive and the insurance companies are making huge profits off of the sick. Under Bernie's plan, people pay significantly less and keep their doctor. Again, this can be paid with, with the wealth tax.

What this all comes down to is that the extremely wealthy in this country are so disgusting rich that if you taxed them a little bit more (they wouldn't even feel it) you could provide the country with free college and medical care.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 12:43pm

"What this all comes down to is that the extremely wealthy in this country are so disgusting rich that if you taxed them a little bit more (they wouldn't even feel it) you could provide the country with free college and medical care."

Sorry but the numbers don't add up to do this plan unless you want to increase taxes on the middle class which is what experts say would have to be done to pay for this type medical care. 

[Mike Barrett]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 12:46pm

^^^^^^^^^ literally so many other countries practice what Bernie is preaching. We're the richest country in the world, but we can't do it? Why are people profiting off of my health care? Thats a much more radical thought to me. I guess getting provided with proper health care and treatment is a privilege in this country, not a right. 

Let alone that we are doing the same exact thing as 2016, putting up a moderate democrat who does not have virtually any progressive policies (ya know, a large faction of the base!), has enough history AND family history for the GOP to spin investigations on, a man who has constantly shown he can't handle a debate, anytime his time is up in a debate he is happy to shut right up, doesn't even try to finish his point, offers nothing to the lower class, still calls marijuana a gateway drug, like are we serious? No even talking about the other candidate in the race, are we seriously just gong to alienate the progressive part of this party and lose again? Joe Biden is the Hillary Clinton of 2020. There time has passed, are only around due to legacy and fear of a more progressive candidate, do not offer progressive policies, and have enough baggage for the GOP to run and claim investigations against throughout the 2020 campaign. Like honestly, is this what Americans want? Joe just told a guy the other day he's full of sh!t! And said he'd stick his hand up his ass or something truly not far from that, I don't have the direct quote infront of me. Like holy crap, REALLY???? 

I hope these debates show how unfit Biden is for office in his current state, along with his policies that do nothing for the middle and lower class. 

EDIT:https://www.washingtonpost.com

May I remind people of when Joe said he'd consider a Republican Running Mate????? Like, DEMOCRATS GET IT TOGETHER. Its funny everyone always gets mad at Bernie and Warren supporters for splitting up the party, yet Dems vote for a person who has no progressive policies and would run with a member of the other party. Jesus Christ America you are so ignorant and stupid its hard to root for ya sometimes. Richest country in the world, billionaires don't pay federal income taxes while I, someone who makes 45K a year (if I'm lucky) has to pay. Joe Biden won't be changing this folks. Is this the world you, your kids, and your grandkids want to live in? 

Updated On: 3/11/20 at 12:46 PM

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 1:05pm

Okay, I’ve tried to refrain from posting last few days, but I gotta lay a few things out there:

1. Both Sanders or Biden would be a vast improvement over the current resident of the White House.
2. Sanders’s plans are even more progressive than every country with the most socialist policies, including Denmark,
3. The math for Bernie’s plans simply doesn’t add up. It never will.
4. If the progressives/young voters wanted Sanders as the nominee, he’d being doing better in the primaries. He is not.
5. The youth vote has actually decreased in almost every state compared to primaries in 2016. They’re not showing up for Sanders. He’s getting trounced in states he handily won in 2016. So Biden is not just Hillary Part Deux.
6. I do think it’s probably good for both candidates to remain in the race for awhile as it forces Trump to divide his attacks rather than solely focusing on one candidate.
7. But given the current trend, if Sanders’s path is clearly non-existent over near few weeks, he should drop out well before the convention so we don’t end up with another divided convention.
8. I love that Biden told that guy (obvious Trumpster) he was FOS because he obviously was.

[Mike Barrett]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 1:34pm

Can't disagree about the young people not turning out for Bernie, its clear, but they certainly haven't for Joe either. 

What is so awful about Bernie's policies tho? Amazon paid ZERO in income taxes, ZERO!!! That's why the math doesn't work. Because companies like that are not paying their fair share. Taxing these billionaires and billion dollar profit companies will also produce billions in revenue for the government, as will legalizing marijuana. Those are 2 easy first steps in finding the $ for all of this. Bernie also doesn't have a congress or senate that worships him as a king, he will likely be forced to compromise should he win the nomination.

People not showing up for Sanders right now doesn't mean Biden isn't Hillary 2.0, Warren votes have taken away from Biden and she was not part of 2016. I expected Bernie's numbers to go down considerably due to his competition (although admittedly not as much as they have). 

The convention won't be divided, other than Warren every single candidate has said they will support the nominee. Not calling you specifically out Miles, but anyone who says the democrats are divided are just trying to sew division when there is none. Bernie has said he will fully back any nominee, as has Biden, even saying he"ll "fight like hell" for Bernie. So there's zero need to worry about the convention. The party, other than towards Bernie or Warren (hmmm smells like 2016) have stated their support for the eventually nominee no matter who it is, including Bernie/Warren. 

I just fear a Joe campaign is the worst to go up against Donald's. Donald has dirt to dig up on Joe, he can only attack Bernie on policy. Thats a win for us, imo. Wherever you stand on policy, Trump genuinely has no idea what he is doing, he cannot attack Bernie's character as the dude has been consistent forever, he can only attack policy. Something he can't really argue against as he doesn't know what he's even discussing. Trump wants a personality and person to attack because he is a big dumb bully, its what he does, not policies or actual politics, he's too dumb for that. Another reason Bernie is better in my book. 

But, as you've said, the young voters are not showing up in the primaries. Im curious though for those who were around, was Obama v Hillary in 2008 similar to where we are with Bernie/Biden now? As in, Hillary is the leading and more moderate candidate, as opposed to Obama who inspired change and had the word "change" in his campaign, yet people were more reluctant to vote for him? Id like to think voters would turnout in the general for Bernie, as they feel no need to vote in a primary. But it may just be wishful thinking on my end. Just curious as Obama clearly got the support in the general and I still feel Bernie could as well, but I was too young to follow how close that relates to today. Obviously trump has taken out any normalcy but still, just curious. 

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 2:01pm

Joe Biden is the nominee, and writing a thousand more paragraphs complaining about it will never change that. You don't know how businesses or the economy work, and you clearly have no financial literacy. People who work hard for their money and run successful business owe you nothing. 

Joe Biden won every single county in Michigan, Missouri, and Mississippi yesterday. Bye BernieBros, it's been real. 

Updated On: 3/11/20 at 02:01 PM

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 2:10pm

I don’t have the answers to all your questions. I will say I think everyone agrees these huge companies should pay their fair share of taxes.

But as you say, that would bring in billions and billions of money. Unfortunately, the Sanders plans would require trillions and trillions of extra incoming revenue from taxes.

My main concern about Sanders is not that these unfeasible plans would be implemented. I doubt even with both houses controlled by Democrats, they’d pass because they'd lack the a) support from Republicans to help pass it with supermajority (60 votes in senate) (I believe they’d need supermajority but not sure) and b) Democrats from red/purple states would get voted out if they supported these proposals.

My main concern is Sanders is not someone who compromises so he’d rather get 0% of what he wants if he can’t get 100%. That’s not really how change happens. It happens more incrementally usually.

Comparing Obama/Clinton in 2008 to Sanders/Biden now is kinda futile. Obama did increase the youth vote as I recall in 2008 but I don’t remember one being painted as more progressive than the other. Both are now painted as moderates now when they’re both progressives just not as far far left as Sanders/Warren. Obama is the kind of candidate that comes along once in a generation.

I liked Sanders’s speech today. He clearly knows their is no path forward and prepped Biden on what he’s going to ask him in the debate on Sunday so Biden can sell himself to Bernie’s supporters. I do believe Sanders will support Biden, but there is a subset of Bernie’s supporters (I believe some are your friends?) who will stay home in November if it’s not Sanders.

[Mike Barrett]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 2:10pm

Sutton Ross said: "Joe Biden is the nominee, and writing a thousand more paragraphs complaining about it will never change that. You don't know how businesses or the economy work, and you clearly have no financial literacy. People who work hard for their money and run successful business owe you nothing.

Bye BernieBros, it's been real."

I know, people like Trump work realllyyyyy hard for their small loans of a million dollars. Its very impressive. 

[Mike Barrett]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 2:21pm

Miles2Go2 said: "I don’t have the answers to all your questions. I will say I think everyone agrees these huge companies should pay their fair share of taxes.

But as you say, that would bring in billions and billions of money. Unfortunately, the Sanders plans would require trillions and trillions of extra incoming revenue from taxes.

My main concern about Sanders is not that these unfeasible plans would be implemented. I doubt even with both houses controlled by Democrats, they’d pass because they'd lack the a) support from Republicans to help pass it with supermajority (60 votes in senate) (I believe they’d need supermajority but not sure) and b) Democrats from red/purple states would get voted out if they supported these proposals.

My main concern is Sanders is not someone who compromises so he’d rather get 0% of what he wants if he can’t get 100%. That’s not really how change happens. It happens more incrementally usually.

Comparing Obama/Clinton in 2008 to Sanders/Biden now is kinda futile. Obama did increase the youth vote as I recall in 2008 but I don’t remember one being painted as more progressive than the other. Both are now painted as moderates now when they’re both progressives just not as far far left as Sanders/Warren. Obama is the kind of candidate that comes along once in a generation.

I liked Sanders’s speech today. He clearly knows their is no path forward and prepped Biden on what he’s going to ask him in the debate on Sunday so Biden can sell himself to Bernie’s supporters. I do believe Sanders will support Biden, but there is a subset of Bernie’s supporters (I believe some are your friends?) who will stay home in November if it’s not Sanders.

"

Thanks for your fair and adult response, Miles. As always you bring civility to this sub as a whole and it doesn't go unnoticed (even if I tend to bring some on the incivility, I admire you and your posts respectfulness of others). 

I think Sanders' speech today shows he's just willing to be honest with himself, which a lot of other candidates don't show publicly. He is an all or nothing sorta guy but again, he's able to realize when things are not going his way and I think he'd be able to adjust accordingly in a Presidential seat. What that means exactly? Idk, and he couldn't tell you either until he's in that position but thats why I'm voting for someone who I believe is able to adapt to a situation like this. I believe that in Bernie. 

The comaprison to Obama/Hillary was a genuine question, so no intention to spark any debate or comparisons there, I simply was like 10 at the time lol. 

Yes some Bernie voters wouldn't show for Biden, but would all moderates show for Bernie? I doubt it, they'd vote 3rd party or would vote for Trump. So it goes both ways here. We're all here on a board discussing for many many pages now about this election, we all here care. We are all voting Blue, no matter who it is. 

Sadly many Americans do not, Bernie supporters or not. They want their way or the highway. I know many moderates who are thrilled for Biden but would never ever vote for Bernie, so it quite simply goes both ways on the topic. Bernie has been outspoken from the beginning he is supporting whoever the Dem nominee is so hopefully his followers will listen, same with Biden's. Hell there was even a poster on here who said they were a "staunch democrat" but said they'd consider voting for Trump if it were Bernie. So again, goes both ways. 

[carnzee]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 4:09pm

As far as comparing Hilary v Obama in '08 to Sanders v Biden:

In '08, Clinton got the white no college vote.

In '16, Sanders got the white no college vote.

In '20 Biden is getting the white no college vote, despite Bernie getting them in '16.

In the general election, that demographic goes to Republicans these days.

Draw your own conclusions. Some have interpreted it this way: in 2008, white no college preferred Clinton to the black guy. In 2016, they cast a protest vote for Sanders because they didn't like Hillary. This year, they prefer Biden over Sanders because they were never crazy about Sanders in 2016, they just didn't like Hillary.

[javero]

Posted: 3/11/20 at 4:43pm

Two more observations about the '08 race.

1. Political dynasties were on their way out.  Bush-Clinton-Bush-Clinton was too much nepotism for much of the electorate.  Similarly, Elizabeth "Libby" Dole lost her bid to retain her US Senate seat in NC that she inherited from the late Jesse Helms.

2. Obama cleverly exploited the blood feud between the Kennedy clan and the Clintons.  Ted Kennedy gave Obama his blessing, and the rest is history.  Long before the arrival of the Trumps, the Clintons were the clan not so well received by the DC political elites.  They had no choice but to tolerate Bill b/c everyone loves a winner.

Some of you should have been around in 1980 to witness Ted Kennedy challenging the incumbent Democrat President Jimmy Carter for the nomination when the latter came up for re-election.  Now that nomination process was a hot mess.  I write all this to suggest that there's nothing new under the sun.

1980: Carter vs. Kennedy left African Americans feeling ignored

Updated On: 3/11/20 at 04:43 PM

[binau]

Posted: 3/12/20 at 5:46pm

A public healthcare system would probably be pretty useful right now...

[Mike Barrett]

Posted: 3/13/20 at 11:45am

qolbinau said: "A public healthcare system would probably be pretty useful right now..."

Sad its taking a virus that could take out millions of people to realize this is the right plan, but nope, people can't afford tests/care so people will die. Yay, America! Profiting off of citizens health! Democracy! 

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/13/20 at 12:13pm

Mike Barrett - Just a couple of questions for you. Why does a young man like you have so much faith in government? Honestly, you don't think the US government is full of corruption and incompetence. I am not saying the private sector is perfect either but believing the government is all so good and pure is a joke IMO. Polls asking what people think of Congress show that their approval rating is barely over 20% which is lots lower than the hated Donald J Trump. Both parties have put us in debt to the tune of over 20 trillion dollars and the programs (Medicare For All, Green New Deal etc) progressives like you want would make that even worse. Studies have shown that their is not enough rich people/corporations in this country to tax that would pay for these programs. Basically, that is what doomed Warren's campaign. How do you and your progressive friends justify paying for health care for people who broke the law and came here illegally. You complained about the taxes you pay (in comparison to billionaires) so wondering if you have no issue with that money going to fund health care and other benefits for illegals. BTW - if you are going to pay benefits to people who came here illegally, should we pay reparations to people who obeyed the law and went through the legal immigration process. The same thing about the government paying off college loans, show me the money for how to pay for that. Did you see the guy who asked Warren if he would get refund since he was adult and paid his own college debt. She looked at him and said no and also looked at him like he was some kind of schmuck. So if you get a chance please answer. I respect your opinion so if you disagree I hope the response is not a political attack on me.

Updated On: 3/13/20 at 12:13 PM

[Miles2Go2]

Posted: 3/13/20 at 12:21pm

FYI - Italy has universal healthcare and it didn’t seem to help them. I’m not saying universal healthcare is bad. I’m just saying maybe now is not the time to bang that drum.

[javero]

Posted: 3/13/20 at 1:48pm

There's a new attack ad out targeting Ivanka, Eric, and Junior Trump.

Grifters: Episode One (Vimeo)

[UncleCharlie]

Posted: 3/13/20 at 5:05pm

Mike Barrett said: "qolbinau said: "A public healthcare system would probably be pretty useful right now..."

Sad its taking a virus that could take out millions of people to realize this is the right plan, but nope, people can't afford tests/care so people will die. Yay, America! Profiting off of citizens health! Democracy!"

Everything I've heard is that the major issue is there have not been enough tests for the people who need them. I haven't heard any stories of tests being available, someone needing one and being denied cause of an inability to afford them. Not sure medicare for all would have caused the tests to be produced any faster.

[yankeefan7]

Posted: 3/14/20 at 9:54am

"Everything I've heard is that the major issue is there have not been enough tests for the people who need them. I haven't heard any stories of tests being available, someone needing one and being denied cause of an inability to afford them. Not sure medicare for all would have caused the tests to be produced any faster."

The bill that was agreed upon in the House and by Trump should help people who need to be tested.