Aladdin "New" Musical Comedy...

[BroadwayBen]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:13pm

So will Disney have to make a case that the score is new, or will it just be understood that since its never been on stage before its "new." Or do they also count the number of songs that are in the show that weren't in the film?

[jv92]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:15pm

As much as a love Menken and Ashman, from what I've heard, most of the score consists of the familiar ALADDIN songs, and the many cut outs Menken and Ashman wrote before the film was retooled after Howard became too ill to work, and passed away. That's not really a new score. And SINCE we have new scores on Broadway this year by the likes of JRB, Andrew Lippa, and Ahrens and Flaherty, I would hope they get the nominations for actual NEW scores.

But that's next June. It's not ever Labor Day 2013!

[tazber]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:16pm

wrong thread

Updated On: 8/29/13 at 05:16 PM

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:17pm

I get sick to my stomach when I read the "reporting" Pat Cesario. His overblown amateurism is a blot on the site.

[jv92]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:19pm

He's very knowledgable, but his interviews are so ass-kissy and obnoxious. And they need editing. We don't need to hear him blab on to a response from John Kander, etc. that reads "Oh, well, thanks for saying that." or something like that.

Example

PC: Blah, blah brilliant, blah blah, I love the album, blah, blah...
JK, SS, AM, SH, etc: Oh, well how nice of you to say that. Thanks.

I mean, that's not really an interview. That's a fan letter.

[trentsketch]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:23pm

At best, they can make the case like they did for The Little Mermaid that the new to the stageshow material (even if it was written before) is significant enough to compete as a new score.

[jv92]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:27pm

Another thing to consider, though, is that much of the ALADDIN stuff that was cut has been put on various CD compilations like THE MUSIC BEHIND THE MAGIC and HOWARD SINGS ASHMAN. So a lot of people have heard it. It's not really new, in the sense that LITTLE MERMAID and BEAUTY AND THE BEAST had a great many new songs by Menken and his new respective lyricists.

It seems like Menken has only written one new song especially for the show. At least, judging from that interview blurb.

[bdn223]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:34pm

Disney could argue that the songs although not "new" were written for the stage if bits of them currently exist in the theme park version of the show. Aladdin will most definitely not win Best Score and Disney knows that. Aladdin is hoping to sweep the technical catagories, and vie for Director and Choreographer to give voters more of a justifyication as to why it deserves "Best PRODUCTION of a Musical".

[jv92]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:37pm

If I'm not mistaken, there was only one new song in the California Adventure production. And that, plus a completely new song for Broadway is only two songs. So they'd lose that argument.

Honestly, and I'm just as guilty for this, let's not talk about awards until we see the show.

Posted: 8/29/13 at 5:38pm

If I remember correctly from Newsies a few years ago, they have to prove that more than 50% of the score was written specifically for this production to be eligible for Best Score. Menken technically won for Newsies because of the handful of new songs that were added (even if they were vastly inferior to the ones in the movie).

If Aladdin only has one new song in it, then it won't be eligible for Best Score

Posted: 8/29/13 at 6:00pm

This discussion is a great example of why he needs to go- Isn't the SHOW he's reporting on SLIGHTLY more important than the ass kissery that clogs the piece? He had time for all that smooching and no time to ask what's in the score? Not to mention his "EXCLUSIVE" is information from a group sales mailer that probably went out to thousands of people. Not really very exclusive at all.

Updated On: 8/29/13 at 06:00 PM

[JohnyBroadway]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 6:48pm

It's a mix of cut Ashman/ Rice numbers along with brand new numbers by Menken and Chad. So will Howard Ashman actually be up for a Tony?

[TheatreKid3]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 6:56pm

I think ALADDIN should and will be eligible for Best Score - and from what I've heard it could be a strong contender at that. Like NEWSIES, a lot of the original music has been altered and expanded significantly. The cut songs from the film were never used in the final product and therefore are new to the body of work that is this new stage production. They are not found intact at all for the show's source material. I don't care how many CDs they may have been put on, they were never a part of the final product/source material the show is based off of and therefore should be considered new.

No Disney show has yet been ruled ineligible for Best Score and I don't think they are going to be now. Also, I think the song from California Adventure was replaced with a different song as well. I remember reading somewhere that it was eventually cut from the new stage production.

If you all didn't know - the entire score from the Seattle production is on YouTube.







Updated On: 8/29/13 at 06:56 PM

[JohnyBroadway]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 7:00pm

Menken's To Be Free hasn't been intact in the show, but that doesn't mean it hasn't been added for the broadway engagement. It serves a wonderful I want moment for Jasmine. One of the few Disney princesses that didn't receive an I want number in her finished film.

[TheatreKid3]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 7:04pm

I think it was replaced with "Call Me a Princess" for Seattle, but yeah they may have added "To Be Free" back in or swapped in back out with the prior.

You're right - Jasmine does lack an 'I Want' song. I hadn't really thought about that.

[Owen22]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 7:49pm

"I get sick to my stomach when I read the "reporting" Pat Cesario. His overblown amateurism is a blot on the site. "

Thank you!! I once got kicked off this site permanently because I complained about him (this is actually my second screen name, I had been around years before this profile's date). I was so sick of his reviews I was actually embarrassed for the celebrities he had to talk to.

[Kad]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 9:26pm

"The cut songs from the film were never used in the final product and therefore are new to the body of work that is this new stage production. "

But they still EXISTED. Just because they're a trunk song doesn't mean they're new and written expressly for the stage production.

[TheatreKid3]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 9:58pm

So? They were never used formally. If I wrote a bunch of songs, kept them in a trunk for 20 years, then finally decided to write a musical and saw that I could use them in it, I would definitely say they should be considered a new score.

Time is so ambiguous. Heck, much of the scores for most shows exist for several years before the production actually goes up (some 10+ years). The argument that they shouldn't count as new bc they have "existed" just sounds silly to me if they had never been used prior.



Updated On: 8/29/13 at 09:58 PM

[Jonwo]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 10:12pm

To be Free I think could be both Jasmine and Genies I want song since both yearn to be free in different ways.

[Kad]

Posted: 8/29/13 at 10:17pm

They've existed and some have been recorded. They are existing parts of the score. Just as reinstating a cut song into an existing musical does not mean it is new material.

It's not new material, which is the qualification for the eligibility.


Edit:
It's really moot anyway, because the movie does not contain enough songs for a full-length musical production and it will need to be padded out substantially.

Updated On: 8/29/13 at 10:17 PM

[jv92]

Posted: 8/31/13 at 11:14am

"Heck, much of the scores for most shows exist for several years before the production actually goes up (some 10+ years)."

Just because a show takes 10 years to produce (which is shameful) does not render a problem. They likely haven't been commercially available, and are premiering for the first time on that stage.

The cut ALADDIN stuff has been available to the public for some 20 years now.

And I doubt Alan Menken cares much about whether or not something's eligible, not, or if he'll win at this point. He's probably more concerned if the show will work on Broadway. So let's stop discussing this stuff until next spring.

And Johny, Howard Ashman has been up for a Tony twice since his death-- BEAUTY AND THE BEAST, and MERMAID, and was nominated for SMILE while he was still with us.

[Kad]

Posted: 8/31/13 at 11:38am

Time isn't a deciding factor for best score, it's intent. Best Score specifically applies to material written expressly for the production.

The Aladdin cut songs were not and would therefore not be eligible for consideration.

[son_of_a_gunn_25]

Posted: 8/31/13 at 1:13pm

"And SINCE we have new scores on Broadway this year by the likes of JRB, Andrew Lippa, and Ahrens and Flaherty, I would hope they get the nominations for actual NEW scores."

I've been away too long! Sounds like I may need to make my way back to the city this year to see some shows.

[TheatreKid3]

Posted: 8/31/13 at 1:59pm

All I'm saying is, based on the score from Seattle alone - not including the new songs it was announced Menken was writing specifically for the Broadway production, ALADDIN's score would definitely qualify just as NEWSIES' did.

With the new songs not only will it qualify, it will probably stand a great chance of winning based on the receptions of the scores coming in this season from their out of town tryouts.

But, yes, Spring is a long way away.

[jv92]

Posted: 8/31/13 at 7:18pm

son_of_a_gun_25: JRB is premiering BRIDGES OF MADISON COUNTY next spring, Lippa's BIG FISH is coming in very shortly...like in a week, and Lynn and Stephen have ROCKY coming in in February.

Regardless of whether or not they're as good as PARADE, WILD PARTY, and RAGTIME (respectively), I'm excited!