And starting with that, 9 of the last 18 winners in that category have gone to comedic roles. So no, there is no bias against comedic performers in this category.
I have a question: don't u guys think that being a dance piece hurts the chances of Illinoise winning Best Musical, especially since both ''Suffs'' and ''Hell's Kitchen'' got really great reviews?
MadsonMelo said: "I have a question: don't u guys think that being a dance piece hurts the chances of Illinoise winning Best Musical, especially since both ''Suffs'' and ''Hell's Kitchen'' got really great reviews?"
I think that is true. I think Illinoise had the best chance if everything sort of underwhelmed. But better than expected reviews for Suffs and Hell's Kitchen probably puts them as the frontrunners at the moment.
Yes, also the fact that it is a late entry will probably hurt them. I'd say being nominated will be their best chance.
MadsonMelo said: "I have a question: don't u guys think that being a dance piece hurts the chances of Illinoise winning Best Musical, especially since both ''Suffs'' and ''Hell's Kitchen'' got really great reviews?"
Not to overreact to tonight's reviews, but....do we think there's actually a chance Cabaret could get left out of revival? All the buzz around this production lately is starting to feel a lot less like "we hate the show" and more "we hate everything about the idea of this production" (between the prices, the London overhype, the immersive aspects, that they felt the need to reinvent this show again, etc). And we've seen in the past when that happens with shows, voters won't hesitate to actively keep them from getting nominated in the production categories (think Mockingbird a few years back, for instance).
So, I'm certainly still predicting it gets in at the current moment. But I'd suddenly be much less shocked if we ended up with a lineup of Merrily, Tommy, Spamalot and Gutenberg.
I still think Cabaret is going to get a revival nomination. None of the other shows got critical raves, and Spamalot and Gutenberg are closed. I'd still put my money on Merrily, Cabaret, and Tommy...with the fourth spot being a bit of a wildcard (though I think it'll go to Gutenberg).
yyys said: "Yes, also the fact that it is a late entry will probably hurt them. I'd say being nominated will be their best chance.
MadsonMelo said: "I have a question: don't u guys think that being a dance piece hurts the chances of Illinoise winning Best Musical, especially since both ''Suffs'' and ''Hell's Kitchen'' got really great reviews?"
No. "Dance pieces" have won Best Musical … Jerome Robbins Broadway, Fosse, Contact. Saw all 3 we and were more moved by Ilinoise than the other two ... choreography, direction, vocals, design and a story/book that allows for big feeings that don't use the typical cliche musical theater way to get it done.
Broadway61004 said: "Not to overreact to tonight's reviews, but....do we think there's actually a chance Cabaret could get left out of revival? All the buzz around this production lately is starting to feel a lot less like "we hate the show" and more "we hate everything about the idea of this production" (between the prices, the London overhype, the immersive aspects, that they felt the need to reinvent this show again, etc). And we've seen in the past when that happens with shows, voters won't hesitate to actively keep them from getting nominated in the production categories (think Mockingbird a few years back, for instance).
So, I'm certainly still predicting it gets in at the current moment. But I'd suddenly be much less shocked if we ended up with a lineup of Merrily, Tommy, Spamalot and Gutenberg."
Nah, I still think it's very likely/a lock to get nominated. But I think its chances to win went way down.
It will still get nominated, along with Merrily and Tommy. I wouldn't be surprised if The Wiz sneaks in. The reviews weren't quite as terrible as word-of-mouth suggested they would be, and the fact that the show will still be running is a huge factor. Tony voters seem to quickly forget shows that close, no matter how well received they are.
It seems like critical response has played an out-sized role this year in clarifying the Tonys race, perhaps because there are so many shows and the public response to many of them has been all over the place. The prospect of Cabaret toppling Merrily seems to have diminished quite a bit (same for Redmayne potentially upsetting Groff). Meanwhile, the generally positive reviews for Suffs and Hell's Kitchen seems to be keeping them in the hunt for a Best Musical nomination.
BoringBoredBoard40 said: "I know atleast two nominators that HATED Cabaret"
This is what I mean. To be clear, I agree with everyone that it is probably going to get nominated. But it does feel like there is a lot of genuine hatred for this production in the NY industry and the whole concept behind it, and we've seen in the past some folks intentionally push shows like that down their ballot (even if they truthfully liked it better than Spamalot, Gutenberg, etc). So will just be interesting to see where this ends up. Could still see it landing 10-12 nominations but could also see it landing 2-3.
I think Cabaret will still do well with nominations - revival, actor, actress, featured actor, featured actress, set, maybe director? These still seem plausible to me. Other than Bebe, I don't think they will win any.
I wonder if Cabaret can still win Set Design and Costume Design. I thought they had very creative costumes but I felt that it was too over the top and the the Theatre was transformed into basically a nightclub but while pre show set (hallways, etc.) where very interesting, the actual show itself is just basically a bare in the round revolve.
I still believe they have very good chances to win Best Lighting Design and Best Sound Design. But who can win Best Costume Design? And can Here Lies Love snatch the Best Scenic Design? I’m starting to think that people are right to think it may end up winning just Best Featured Actress.
Markie27 said: "I wonder if Cabaret can still win Set Design and Costume Design. I thought they had very creative costumes but I felt that it was too over the top and the the Theatre was transformed into basically a nightclub but while pre show set(hallways, etc.) where very interesting, the actual show itself is just basically a bare in the round revolve.
I still believe they have very good chances to win Best Lighting Design and Best Sound Design. But who can win Best Costume Design? And can Here Lies Love snatch the Best Scenic Design? I’m starting to think that people are right to think it may end up winning just Best Featured Actress."
I think Gatsby might still be in the mix for some of the technical awards and Back to the Future for Scenic/Lighting. I think for both those shows (as well as Cabaret), it depends on how much the dislike of the show as a whole trickles down to the technical categories.
All guesswork, but if the nominators track the critics (and they often pointedly do not), i can see Redmayne and certainly Rankin getting snubbed, whereas Neuwirth and Skybell seem to be locks at this point. And it would not be a clear upset, and downright shocking, if it took Best Revival away from Merrily (the reviews for Tommy seemed just as tepid as those for Cabaret...)
So it's starting to look like Hell's Kitchen vs. Illinoise? Suffs will certainly be in the conversation. Hoping for Here Lies Love to get in there ... with other possibilities being OUTSIDERS, W4E, THE NOTEBOOK.
I do find it fascinating that Hell's Kitchen could possibly win BEST MUSICAL, after the colossal failure of last seasons attempt at a love letter to the city (NY, NY).
CoffeeBreak said: "yyys said: "Yes, also the fact that it is a late entry will probably hurt them. I'd say being nominated will be their best chance.
MadsonMelo said: "I have a question: don't u guys think that being a dance piece hurts the chances of Illinoise winning Best Musical, especially since both ''Suffs'' and ''Hell's Kitchen'' got really great reviews?"
No. "Dance pieces" have won Best Musical … Jerome Robbins Broadway, Fosse, Contact.Sawall 3 we and were more moved by Ilinoise than the other two ... choreography, direction, vocals, designanda story/bookthat allows for bigfeeings that don't usethe typical cliche musical theater way to get it done."
My question was, actually, because of ''Contact''.
Which won decades ago and sparkled so much controversy that they created Best Theatrical Event next year.
That's why I think ''Illinoise'' can suffer the bias.
If Illinoise is so beloved, though, and if there’s no consensus among voters, it can still pull ahead. It’s a show that could easily tour, and if marketed well, it could draw a lot of fans of the album and of dance to the show. It’s a show that is competitive in several categories, including choreography, lighting and sound design, and orchestrations. I can see this getting just as many if not more nominations than other top contenders. I think there was a lot of backlash with Contact because there wasn’t any live music, which isn’t the case here: the live music is heavily featured and the basis of the storytelling.
I posted my predictions in another thread, but here they are with some updates.
BEST MUSICAL Hell’s Kitchen Here Lies Love Illinoise The Outsiders Suffs
BEST REVIVAL OF A MUSICAL Cabaret Gutenberg! The Musical! Merrily We Roll Along The Who’s Tommy
BEST ACTOR IN A MUSICAL Cabaret, Eddie Redmayne Days of Wine and Roses, Brian d’Arcy James Harmony, Chip Zien Merrily We Roll Along, Jonathan Groff The Outsiders, Brody Grant
BEST ACTRESS IN A MUSICAL Cabaret, Gayle Rankin Days of Wine and Roses, Kelli O’Hara Hell’s Kitchen, Maleah Joi Moon Lempicka, Eden Espinosa Suffs, Shaina Taub
BEST FEATURED ACTOR IN A MUSICAL Hell’s Kitchen, Brandon Victor Dixon Here Lies Love, Conrad Ricamora Merrily We Roll Along, Daniel Radcliffe The Outsiders, Joshua Boone The Outsiders, Brent Comer
BEST FEATURED ACTRESS IN A MUSICAL Cabaret, Bebe Neuwirth Merrily We Roll Along, Lindsay Mendez Monty Python’s Spamalot, Leslie Rodriguez Kritzer The Outsiders, Emma Pittman Suffs, Nikki M. James
BEST DIRECTION OF A MUSICAL Hell’s Kitchen, Michael Greif Here Lies Love, Alex Timbers Illinoise, Justin Peck Merrily We Roll Along, Maria Friedman Suffs, Leigh Silverman
BEST ORIGINAL SCORE Days of Wine and Roses Here Lies Love The Outsiders Stereophonic Suffs
BEST BOOK OF A MUSICAL Days of Wine and Roses Hell’s Kitchen Lempicka The Outsiders Suffs
BEST CHOREOGRAPHY Cabaret Hell’s Kitchen Illinoise The Outsiders Suffs
BEST ORCHESTRATIONS Days of Wine and Roses Hell’s Kitchen Illinoise Merrily We Roll Along Suffs
BEST SCENIC DESIGN OF A MUSICAL Cabaret The Great Gatsby Here Lies Love Water for Elephants The Wiz
BEST COSTUME DESIGN OF A MUSICAL Cabaret Lempicka Merrily We Roll Along Suffs The Wiz
BEST LIGHTING DESIGN OF A MUSICAL Hell’s Kitchen Here Lies Love Illinoise The Outsiders Water for Elephants
BEST SOUND DESIGN OF A MUSICAL Back to the Future Hell’s Kitchen Here Lies Love Merrily We Roll Along The Outsiders
BEST PLAY Jaja’s African Hair Braiding Mother Play Patriots Prayer for the French Republic Stereophonic
BEST REVIVAL OF A PLAY Appropriate Doubt An Enemy of the People Purlie Victorious
BEST ACTOR IN A PLAY Doubt, Liev Schreiber An Enemy of the People, Jeremy Strong Patriots, Michael Stuhlbarg Purlie Victorious, Leslie Odom Jr.
BEST ACTRESS IN A PLAY Appropriate, Sarah Paulson Doubt, Amy Ryan Mary Jane, Rachel McAdams Mother Play, Jessica Lange
BEST FEATURED ACTOR IN A PLAY Appropriate, Corey Stoll Patriots, Will Keen The Shark Is Broken, Alex Brightman Stereophonic, Will Brill Uncle Vanya, William Jackson Harper
BEST FEATURED ACTRESS IN A PLAY Doubt, Zoe Kazan Mother Play, Celia Keenan-Bolger Prayer for the French Republic, Francis Benhamou Purlie Victorious, Kara Young Stereophonic, Sarah Pidgeon
BEST DIRECTION OF A PLAY Appropriate, Lila Neugebauer An Enemy of the People, Sam Gold Prayer for the French Republic, David Cromer Purlie Victorious, Kenny Leon Stereophonic, Daniel Aukin
BEST SCENIC DESIGN OF A PLAY Doubt Grey House Patriots Purlie Victorious Stereophonic
BEST COSTUME DESIGN OF A PLAY The Cottage An Enemy of the People Mother Play Purlie Victorious Stereophonic
BEST LIGHTING DESIGN OF A PLAY Appropriate An Enemy of the People Patriots Purlie Victorious Stereophonic
BEST SOUND DESIGN OF A PLAY Appropriate Patriots Purlie Victorious The Shark Is Broken Stereophonic
I think these look great overall but if Lempicka gets a nomination for Best Book I may never pay attention to the Tony’s again. Had a great time at that show but the book is a MESS.
Ensemble1713124420 said: "I think these look great overall but if Lempicka gets a nomination for Best Book I may never pay attention to the Tony’s again. Had a great time at that show but the book is a MESS."
They nominated NY NY last year and that book was atrocious.