Alec Baldwin Shooting

[JGPR2]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 12:15pm

Alec Baldwin shot and killed one person and another is injured when he fired prop gun while filming a movie scene. Can anybody tell me why the heck there was real ammunition in the gun? Who is responsible for checking these guns? Even though it was an accident, who has a chance of being sued for the wrongful death?

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 12:21pm

This keeps coming up in all the commentary. Those of us who lived through the Jon Eric Hexum and Brandon Lee Eras know that sometimes blanks discharge detritus. Sometimes horrible tragedies ensue.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 12:24pm

But they’re saying it wasn’t a blank but an actual bullet. This is so awful all around. I obviously feel awful for the woman who died but can’t imagine the guilt that Baldwin is going to be feeling for the rest of his life over this.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 12:25pm

"They" are? I haven't immersed myself in it but none of the sources I read state that.

 

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 12:55pm

FindingNamo said: "This keeps coming up in all the commentary. Those of us who lived through the Jon Eric Hexum and Brandon Lee Eras know that sometimes blanks discharge detritus. Sometimes horrible tragedies ensue."

Brandon Lee was killed by .44 caliber slug. The gun was supposed to be loaded with blanks but was accidently loaded with live ammunition. 

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 1:02pm

The latest is "Detectives are investigating how and what type of projectile was discharged."

If it was a real bullet (why the hell would it be on a movie set?) then someone REALLY fu*ked up. However, I think it was a blank packed with too much powder for a that extra loud bang when it fires. 

This almost never happens because I hear movie/tv sets are extra careful when it comes to gun safety. What a tragedy for everyone involved especially Ms. Hutchins and her family. 

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 1:07pm

Well on MSNBC this morning, “they” reported that.

[Alex Kulak2]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 2:18pm

It's incredibly unlikely that there were live rounds anywhere on set. Brandon Lee's death was caused by the crew modifying real bullets to be blanks, which was a grievous oversight that has been heavily regulated since then to prevent tragedies like this.

It's more likely that it was the wadding in the blank which is meant to control the muzzle flash. It can still fire out of the barrel, and be lethal if fired at close range. It's the reason why you never point a gun at another person when performing in a play or a movie, even if you know it's empty/has blanks.

[FindingNamo]

Posted: 10/22/21 at 11:44pm

That's what happened to Jon Eric Hexum, gawd rest his chest.

[SmoothLover]

Posted: 10/23/21 at 12:56am

Seems like there was some sloppiness all around including the direction Baldwin pointed the gun.

[JGPR2]

Posted: 10/23/21 at 9:51am

Ok, please help me out here. In the world we live in today with all the film technology, Hollywood can't make a gun scene look/sound like gun was fired without actor actually firing a gun. It just seems to a complete novice that they should be able to do this and eliminate any future accidents.

[latitudex1]

Posted: 10/23/21 at 10:21am

JGPR2 said: "Ok, please help me out here. In the world we live in today with all the film technology, Hollywood can't make a gun scene look/sound like gun was fired without actor actually firing a gun. It just seems to a complete novice that they should be able to do this and eliminate any future accidents."

From what's been reported, this didn't happen during filming. It happened during rehearsal. The AD handed Baldwin what he thought was a "cold" (empty) gun, and Baldwin began taking it in and out of the holster and pointing it. 

The prop master, armorer, and assistant director have quite a bit of explaining to do to the cops and to the unions.

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 10/23/21 at 2:36pm

Very disturbing.

[latitudex1]

Posted: 10/23/21 at 3:13pm

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/23/us/alec-baldwin-rust-shooting.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

Inadvertent Gun Discharges Occurred on Alec Baldwin Film Before Fatal Shooting, Crew Members Say

They expressed concerns over gun mishaps and working conditions just days before the shooting that killed the cinematographer Halyna Hutchins.

[sabrelady]

Posted: 10/24/21 at 12:11am

There is a lot of conflicting/missing information. For example one name / job title I have not seen is the production manager. That is the person who, hires, budgets, fires ,works out the shooting sched, locations, sets ( along w the dept heads and directors) If there were earlier irregularities that person should have the records ( some times 2nd AD but PM has the final say) producers( like Baldwin) to my knowledge rarely get involved with the day to day minutia . 

I can't talk about safety protocols as I think they vary state to state. I remember at one point I heard a rumour That Montréal was allowing live ammo. I didn't ever find out if it was true. 

I can say that here in Ontario we are careful to the point of paranoia. Our sets require ETF officers present usually about a 1/2 hr b4 the gun handler arrived and they stayed till the guns were wrapped.( also present w special effects w fire/explosions) I've done a few independent shows and NO one messes w that rule. In a right to work state I can't say what corners maybe cut on who they use in what field. 

BUT I wanna tell u another story here that happened to me. I was on set as set nurse. There was an elaborate shoot out planned around a car which was squibbed to within its molecular bonds. There were also 3 actors firing guns  w blanks  from the opposite side myself, ETF, hair, makeup etcs was on. There were also 4 flags( large square light reflectors)  on at the trunk end of the car one at the hood one angled at the R head light and one angled at the R rear light that one unlike the others which were cardboard or fabric it was made of tin. I had been standing behind that one w ETF when he moved me and himself 2 feet to the Right. Walkies off and the special effect of the squibs went off and the bad guys started firing. Everything finishes we check  that every one s good weapons handler goes to collect the guns and as ETF and I were walking away- there is a Yell " hey guys come back u gotta see this"  ETF and I looked at looked at other for a 2nd and came back to see that the tin flag now had 2 deep indent in it just south of its centre. and just below that was a full on puncture IN METAL. A softer metal but still punch some tin about 3 cm thick and see what happens.. WE had been standing right behind. Our PM was called to set  he the gun handler and ETF went through the guns and the blank ammo and eventually all his ammo(not just the open box) was confiscated. The boxes were tested at the police ballistics and were found to have 3x the charge they were actually labelled.

The manufacture was contacted and did a recall.

MY POINT you can do everything right and something you could not have known or planned for can still happen and bring ( tho not in my case luckily) a world of trouble and hurt.

G*D bless all involved  in this sad situation.

 

 

[sabrelady]

Posted: 10/27/21 at 2:42am

Claudia Black from twitter

If you’re an aspiring actor, and as my advice was good enough for a young Mcavoy I pray you’ll listen now.
When we were filming Pitch Black a producer came to give me a choice. They had a problem and needed to do a reshoot with me and a stuntie. The shoot thus far had been rough

he crew was exhausted. 6 day weeks are unsustainable. Mistakes happen when crews are tired and often on the 6th day. The crew couldn’t say “no” to another Saturday but I could. I asked when they needed a decision & went to speak with some crew. I made sure that they themselves 

were choosing —rest vs an overtime paycheck— I would not presume to know their needs and priorities. They chose safety and rest. “Safety First,” is after all, an oft heard refrain on any decent set with its priorities in check. I returned to the producer and told him I was too 

tired and didn’t want to work the Saturday. He looked at me for a few seconds. I was a good actor and a bad liar. He went to say something, nodded instead and rescheduled. We do a lot of things on sets that would otherwise be illegal. It can be thrilling. It’s a privilege. 

It should never cost
a life. I was in my early 20’s when I was asked to make that decision ostensibly for me though realistically on behalf of many. Thankfully I live without regret. For 30 years I’ve been working with firearms consistently and never once

referred to a firearm 

as a prop; it’s a deadly weapon. If you’re on a set that doesn’t provide weapons training & an armorer, I’d leave. If you see an actor put their finger on a trigger before action is called I’d step away, bring it to their attention and tell the AD & armorer a review is necessary. 

If an armorer is using live amo on a set, leave, yet treat every “prop” as if it’s fully loaded & never point it at anyone. If anyone but the armorer tries to hand you a firearm, it’s a major red flag. There should be no middle man. Just you and your armorer make the exchange. 

Actors get infantilized on sets then criticized for childish behavior. I don’t care

I don’t care what number you are on the call sheet. Lead. From the back of the pack if you have to. No job nor career is worth a life. I have pulled stunts early in my career when I could tell they were dodgy. 

Your stunt double is there to make you look cool but they often do not feel empowered to speak up. Check in with them and use your voice. It’s not about heroism it’s about humanity and navigating frustrating and fateful hierarchies. Whenever I have weapons training and they ask 

if I’ve had experience with firearms, after 30 years I still say, “Yes, but assume I know nothing and teach me everything.” (I am repeatedly told by armorers and stunt departments that women are easier to train bc they do not think they know everything.) Beginners Mind will keep 

you humble and others safe. Film culture is unique. Our days are more 5-9 than 9-5. We work on a 24 hr clock and in TV and indie filmmaking, time is the enemy. We hurry up & wait right before we rush to complete the call sheet & before we lose light. We are carnie folk; the kids 

who didn’t fit in; rebels, outliers,misfits, neurodiverse arty farties. We are a circus that packs up & leaves once the film or series is “in the can” never to reassemble with the same people in the same way again. We experience little deaths in our hearts every time we wrap. 

Processing that grief & post shoot anticlimax is part of the gig after bonding closely with fellow wild ones hired to recreate some aspect of humanity,only to disperse and move on. We should never be grieving an actual crew member’s preventable death when playing make believe. 

Play requires the safety of a responsible container. The producers are in charge of that. They need to set up that container, nourish and maintain it with crystal clear communication. They need to listen and actually care and follow through. They need to identify toxic behavior 

and address it head on. For too long people who consider themselves to be “non creatives,” have indulged toxic and unsafe behaviors because they think it goes with the territory of being arty and are terrified that if confronted, the artist will walk off and filming will stop. So 

In this tipping point moment and on this two-way street; actors, please, prioritize being good people before being a great artist. Put the crew first. Speak up. Cultivate an environment of verbal consent. I offer consent to male artists now and they are confused at first by the 

offer. Persist. You can always find something that a male actor does not like having done to his body. And once you establish that baseline, all the off-air scripts change; vulnerability is better understood. Safety first. Because from safety, comes great play and beautiful art; 

elicious co-creation. If you create great art
in spite of toxicity it’s a tenuous, unrepeatable, unsustainable and lonely phenomenon. So listen. Observe. Ask questions. Check in with the crew and make *them* cups of tea. Ask them how you make their jobs hard even though movie 

stars aren’t supposed to. I am devastated about Halyna.
Walking onto a set on Friday morning right after reading the news, I had to work yet again with firearms and a wobbly yet fiercely professional stunt department. We had a top armorer quite literally in the trenches with 

us. As I stepped onto the muddy set I turned to the armorer and said, “ I’m so grateful you’re here.” I turned to the courageous and dutiful stunties, asked if they were ok and said, “ If you see or feel something today that worries you, anything, and you speak up and are not  

heard, find me and I shall speak. *Loudly*” Relative safety and art should be mutually inclusive. It’s where the secret sauce resides. It’s where true cinema magic is cultivated. The set is my home. If it’s yours too, treat it as you would, the safe haven it deserves to be— 

especially for those of us who never found a home anywhere else. 

 

She nailed it.

 

 

[dkimlaw]

Posted: 12/15/21 at 10:14am

Every time I read about this it saddens me as it is an accident that brings many repercussions in the industry, this would not happen in California, too much negligence together.