Pippin (1981 TV version) - The Fosse Version

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 3:46am

With all of the talk about the revival of Pippin, I finally revisited the original "Fosse" cut of the '81 televised version. I was wondering if anyone could give an official--or more or less--version on why the version that was televised, and is on DVD cut the 25 or so minutes?

Watching it again this way--after being so used to the released edit--, so much more makes sense, especially the character of Catherine.

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:28am

Both for time, and due to disagreements between Fosse and David Sheehan over close-ups versus wider angles to show the dancing and the cast. Fosse reportedly chose mostly close-up shots while Sheehan's were much better in terms of visual composition and showcased angles where you saw the other actors.

If I ruled the world, I'd put out a restored version re-adding only what exists in the "Fosse cut" that doesn't in the released version. Then we'd have the best of both worlds.

Edited to add: Also forgot that Sheehan, in at least one instance, maybe a few more, created a better joke by editing, in this case, in the Berthe scene. After "I know what I need, Pippin," which is a laugh on its own and could imply exactly what you think it implies, the exchange goes on for another second in the "Fosse cut" as Berthe reveals what she really needs: some juicy court gossip, adding that she's wondering if a handsome priest is still listening to confession. The rest of the joke falls flat, and it's far better, in my opinion, for her to just get the laugh on that first line. This is one instance where I think editing helped rather than hindered the overall product, just as an example.

Updated On: 5/2/13 at 08:28 AM

[chewy5000]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:37am

Does anyone know where one can find a copy of this "Fosse cut"?

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:39am

In my bedroom.

[chewy5000]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:42am

I'll be over in 10.

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:44am

Check your inbox, chewy. You won't have to go visit Jordan for this one.

[chewy5000]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:58am

But I was looking forward to seeing his furniture...

[PalJoey]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 8:58am

NOW you tell me.

[Jamie Pierce]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 9:01am

I'm curious as to why, in the Fosse cut, Chita's scene and song - both that which was and was not included in the commercial version - is clearly an alternate take from start to finish?

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 9:09am

If you want it, Joey, you can have it, too. (I'm assuming you mean the "Fosse cut.")

J52, multiple performances of a play are always filmed in order to cut together the best possible version. In this case, Fosse and Sheehan probably just disagreed on which performance was the best to include. Draw your own conclusions.

[Jamie Pierce]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 9:56am

One thing is for sure, the elements that were cut from the Fastrada section are quite racy: the monologue, some of the choreography, the interactions with Lewis. Were these in the original staging? Definitely tamed down for the revival.

[Brick]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 11:40am

I had no idea there was another edit than the released version! I'm dying to see it, too. Could someone PM me?

[ForPoland]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 11:58am

So does the "Fosse Cut" include the complete show? I'd be very interested in that myself.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 1:56pm

I have an edit with the Fosse footage edited back into the commercial footage I can upload if anyone wants it.

Updated On: 5/2/13 at 01:56 PM

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 3:11pm

^ I'm shocked someone actually tried, given the condition of the Fosse cut. I'd love to have it.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 4:59pm

Phyllis--I'd love to see that, actually. ForPoland--it is the complete show.

[HoldThatThought]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 5:34pm

Phyllis - is it warble-free and easier to watch than the Fosse cut? If so, I'd like to see that as well.

[Phyllis Rogers Stone]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 5:43pm

I'm having trouble uploading it, so it will be a little while.

It's the commercial dvd with the the stuff that was edited out put back in. There is (obviously) a notable difference when it switches back and for from the commercial dvd to the Fosse stuff because I only had access to the same low gen copy of the Fosse cut that everyone else has. Sorry if I anyone was expecting a pristine copy! I mainly just did it so that I'd have the whole show in one place and only have to deal with the cruddy parts for the stuff that was cut originally.

[EricMontreal22]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 5:45pm

I still am really excited to see it--thank you!

[Noelle Hannibal]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 7:37pm

Me too?!

[choitoy]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 7:48pm

Count me in too!

I just recently watched the commercially released version, and even though I don't know the show too well, I could tell that there were a bunch of cuts, as a lot of it seemed way to choppy.

[frontrowcentre2]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 7:49pm

ForPoland--it is the complete show.

Does it include "I Guess I'll Miss The Man."?

[HoldThatThought]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 7:59pm

"Does it include "I Guess I'll Miss The Man."?"

It's been awhile since i've watched it, but I'm pretty sure it does.

Phyllis - kudos to you for editing it like that! I think I'd still like to check it out. Thanks!

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 9:09pm

frontrowcentre2, yes it does.

choitoy and Noelle Hannibal, on the way!

[logan2]

Posted: 5/2/13 at 9:32pm

Hi g.d.e.l.g.i.
I would love to see it too. I sent you a PM.