Can A Musical.Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Can A Musical.Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Mr Roxy
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/17/03
#1Can A Musical.Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 6:59pm
On The Town
Only 3 songs survived from the show and yet the movie still worked.
Poster Emeritus
#2Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 7:05pm
I think the film of A FUNNY THING HAPPENED ON THE WAY TO THE FORUM is still a marvelous movie despite its evisceration of the score.
Though that could be related to the fact that many say there's no need for it to be a musical or Sondheim's score is ill-fitting or whatever.
Keeping BroadwayWorld Illustrated
Updated On: 2/28/15 at 07:05 PM
#2Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 7:09pmNINE is an example of it NOT working.
#3Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 7:10pmA good movie is a good movie. A bad movie is a bad movie. A movie can be good with a bad score, bad with a good score, good with a good score, bad with a bad score. How could there be a sensible answer to your question? One you seem to have answered yourself for yourself without any help.
#4Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 7:44pmI don't think a movie musical should stay entirely true to the stage counterparts. Look at the Producers the movie. It stayed almost exactly true, even the sets, to the stage show and it was a flop.
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Theater Workers for a Ceasefire
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#5Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 7:45pmOf course.
Countdown til Jordan comes on raging about how much loves me! 3..2..1...
Fantod
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/3/14
#6Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:18pm
I appreciate that the Forum movie cut some of the unnecessary and, let's be real, ugly score of Sondheim's. However, the movie also cuts a good deal of the, in my mind, perfect book. The show also just works so much better on stage where the audience is a character. I am assistant directing a production of it now and despite the fact that our cast is not as good, it just works better live.
On the thread title, Chicago.
#7Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:25pm
I wouldn't say Chicago had its score "gutted".
Cabaret had its score gutted and it's a brilliant film.
....but the world goes 'round
Updated On: 3/1/15 at 08:25 PM
Auggie27
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/13/03
#8Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:26pm
Somewhere in the middle is "Bye Bye Birdie," a favorite from childhood that has a souped up third act in the screenplay (the drug that speeds up ballet dancers on Ed Sullivan's show, still shockingly horrible, worst than ever) and basically cut the material that Rivera scored with on B'way. But how 60s was that? Casting Janet Leigh in a black fright wig as a Latina. Needless to say, the Latina went bye-bye.
Much of the score is there, sure, but the leading lady's songs were gone, and Ann-Margaret's Kim got a new title tune, the rendition of which stole the entire movie. It did then, it still does.
How about "Lady in the Dark," which dared use Ginger Rogers and then almost killed the score entirely. "The Saga of Jenny" and "Girl of the Moment" remained, and part of "This Is New" is played by a nightclub band in the background. Part of "My Ship" was hummed by Ginger Rogers, but the song itself was never sung.
"I'm a comedian, but in my spare time, things bother me." Garry Shandling
Updated On: 2/28/15 at 08:26 PM
#9Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:29pm
Or the ultimate, One Touch of Venus which cut every single song.
....but the world goes 'round
#10Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:41pm
^^^^^^
Ugh such a travesty! "Speak Low" actually remained though.
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Showface
Broadway Legend Joined: 6/25/14
#11Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 8:54pm
It depends. Yes, if it's for a good reason! Film and theatre are different mediums and adaptation is necessary, so cut songs are inevitable. I think there are rules for me when judging a film adaptation's success...I think it must be pretty faithful, unless the piece is revitalized in a new form (which I am always welcome to), like Chicago...the cut songs were necessary, because they went for a concept.
Fantod
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/3/14
#12Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 9:08pm
Kiss Me, Kate is pretty good, though likes the humor of the stage show
Agree re: Cabaret
Also Irma La Douce cut every single song and is pretty good.
Wilmingtom
Broadway Legend Joined: 7/18/11
#13Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 2/28/15 at 9:18pmBabes In Arms was a shame. Only the title song and Where or When were retained from that great score.
#14Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 7:22am
The problem with gutting a score (as in "Sweeney Todd") is that it destroys the expectations of fans of the stage version. I believe that musicals translate best to screen when they use most or all of the songs, even if some of them are shortened, and even if scenes are moved around.
I may be in the minority, but I think that "Les Miz" and "The Phantom of the Opera" worked as screen musicals, despite the problems with some of the singing. The scores remained generally intact, but, in both cases, the writers and directors bowed to the differences between screen and film -- in each, they took advantage of the opportunity to cut back and forth quickly between scenes, to break up scenes that would have to run together on stage, and to add visual context. Perhaps most importantly, each took advantage of the absence of an intermission, by moving key scenes that ended Act I on stage; in my view, moving "Do You Hear the People Sing" and the chandelier crash improved both stories.
The only major cut that I can think of in POTO was the rehearsal scene, which I'm not sure would have worked on film. Conversely, in Les Miz, the addition of the song "Suddenly" answered a key question that the stage musical fails to address: Did JVJ view raising Cosette as merely the fulfillment of a promise to Fantine, or did he really love the child?
Perhaps with the trend towards releasing Blu-Rays/DVDs of Broadway shows, we can put the question to rest regarding whether movie musicals should stay true to their stage counterparts. If people can view the original stage production, they are not likely to feel cheated if the movie runs off in a different direction.
Audrey, the Phantom Phanatic, who nonetheless would rather be Jean Valjean, who knew how to make lemonade out of lemons.
jo
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/15/03
#15Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 7:48am
Very good points, Liebross!
If I may add -- especially in the film adaptation of LES MISERABLES, the director and creative team likewise considered aspects of the novel which were glossed over in the stage musical. "Suddenly" was added to highlight the second epiphany that Valjean experienced. His first vision related to what he experienced when he realized what the Bishop of Digne showed to him and set him on the road to redemption. That taught him the value of virtue. His realization of his feelings for Cosette taught him the value of love. Such stirring passages in the novel highlighted those realizations. The theme of Suddenly is repeated when Valjean had left Cosette to Marius's full keeping - as if to highlight that his care of her has now come full circle. Likewise the relationship of Marius with his grandfather was re-emphasized in the film version and thus we see Valjean and the grandfather singing in counterpoint when the recovering Marius returns with Cosette.
Some songs were shortened (such as Drink with Me, A Little Fall of Rain, Turning, Beggars at the Feast) or even omitted ( Thenardier's song at the sewers) without losing the intention of those musical passages to keep the film flowing more smoothly.
On the other hand, The Confrontation came out so much better in the film with the addition of the fight scene while Valjean and Javert sang about the conflict between them.
#16Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 11:22am
You can hear a lot of the score of A Little Night Music in the film, but who wants to?
http://youtu.be/eDtZXtKuQ5c
#17Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 12:28pmhow about "best little whorehouse in texas"?? you can barely see much similarity in the scores.
henrikegerman
Broadway Legend Joined: 4/29/05
#18Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 1:01pm
FUNNY GIRL!
CABARET!
Updated On: 3/1/15 at 01:01 PM
#19Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 4:42pm
"You can hear a lot of the score of A Little Night Music in the film, but who wants to? "
Ironically you then link to a song written for the movie and not in the stage version :P I actually think much of the score in ALNM that was kept is very well performed, which is why I'm glad the soundtrack finally came out on CD. Speaking just musically, Len Carious sounds more assured than he does on the OBCR, the re-arrangement of Now/Soon/Later works well, as does the edit and the added bit for Weekend in the Country, Diana Rigg is flawless and Tunick's new orchestrations for Little Death improve on the already great originals, the new Glamorous Life is a gorgeous song, etc....
Auggie27
Broadway Legend Joined: 10/13/03
#20Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 4:56pm^As I've posted often, that version of "Glamorous Life" remains my favorite, the inclusion of "Fredericka's Song" as I think Sondheim dubs it. I know the master isn't fond of it, and doesn't allow it to be licensed with the stage editions, despite the NT edition, but it's actually one of my favorite pieces in the entire Sondheim canon ("And sometime this summer...", her heartfelt expectation of a reunion with her mother is just moving and to my ears always lovely.)
"I'm a comedian, but in my spare time, things bother me." Garry Shandling
#21Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 5:16pm
^ Absolutely concur with everything you've said here. One of the loveliest creations in all of Sondheim.
What if her brooch is
Made of glass
And her costumes unravel?
What if her coach is
Second class?
She at least gets to travel!
Ravishing
#22Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 5:38pmThat song really is amazing, one of my all-time favorites of his.
Keeping BroadwayWorld Illustrated
#23Can A Musical Have Its Score Gutted For The Screen And Still Be Good?
Posted: 3/1/15 at 5:44pmYikes! Wrong thread... Updated On: 3/1/15 at 05:44 PM
