Flower Drum Song revival - should it happen

[222disneyland]

Posted: 3/18/18 at 9:38pm

thoughts 

[fredric47]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 5:23am

Funny, you should ask. I am an aspiring musical theatre producer. "Flower Drum Song" was the first Broadway musical I was taken to see as a child in its original production and then the 1961 movie version. I have always loved the score and the story has interested me. I never saw the David Henry Hwang revisal although I own a cd copy of its recording. Philadelphia, where I am based, has never seen the Hwang revisal. So I would certainly consider "Flower Drum Song" among the top 20 shows that I would most want to present in Philadelphia. Of course, I know you meant a Broadway revival. For Broadway, I wouldn't see why anyone would want to bring the show back since the David Henry Hwang revisal wasn't a success. I welcome others thoughts on this matter.

[denali.fire]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 9:31am

No.

[Loopin’theloop]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 10:13am

Fredric47 I didn’t see the revival but I read the updated script, with a view to doing it.

In my opinion, if it’s to be done at all then someone needs to start from the or original and do another resisal. The Hwang book creates as many issues as it solves. It’s a shame, as his intentions were clearly good but his book is just full of cheap, cheap gags and although one might argue it being less offensive it is seems equally dated.

The music is, of course beautiful.

[Kad]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 10:14am

It's a marvelous score and one of the very few works in musical theatre that allow performers of Asian descent to portray characters written specifically for them.

But the original is pretty much the epitome of problematically dated, and Hwang's revisal is just not very good at all.

 

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 10:15am

If I were to revive it, I would not use the Hwang revival at all. I'd update the book a bit and work on the problematic parts but keep the story and characters as originally written in-tact. I'd also love it if they could adopt some of the movie version's renditions of the songs and the song order if possible. In the Hwang revival, didn't they give Mei Li another ballad borrowed from Pipe Dream? I do think Mei Li probably needs another number unless the revival does a Hwang and gets rid of the character of Helen Chao and gives Mei Li the song "Love Look Away" which I wouldn't do.

Considering the amount of work that needs to be done and I just don't see Flower Drum Song ever being commercial enough outside of the West Coast, this is one of those "why bother?" ideas.

Updated On: 3/19/18 at 10:15 AM

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 3/19/18 at 11:12am

I would love to see this but keeping the original book intact and honoring the now-un-PC aspects of the musical.  Keeping the original setting and keeping it as a time-capsule of the era it was written (1958).  Sher at the helm, of course.  Only he seems to understand how to re-interpret and honor older musicals without completely modifying them. 

[Mr. Nowack]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 2:00am

Could one reach back to the original source book and revise it using elements of that, or would the material there also be considered "problematical dated?"

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 3:34am

Why not just do the original and do what Jack O’Brien did to Carousel and cut the songs and lines you don’t like?

[fashionguru_23]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 8:44am

I've only been able to find a copy of the 2002 revival libretto. Is the original one that bad?

[bk]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 1:33pm

The original Flower Drum Song was fine - nothing wrong with it except people's inabilities to understand context.  It was adapted from a novel by a Chinese person.  Every time someone tells me a show would not go over well today it just makes me want to do it to prove them wrong.  

[Kad]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 1:48pm

Yeah, I'm sure you'll be able to convince Asian-Americans that you know better about what's offensive to them.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 2:03pm

To this day, the film remains one of the few motion pictures featuring a majoriy of Asian actors. It’s historic. I think there is a way to make this specifically Asian-American story work. Maybe go back to the original source? I love that this show tackles what it means to be Asian-American and it’s not a typical East-meets-West plot. I have to give major props to Rodgers and Hammerstein for even attempting such a story.

[markypoo]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 2:17pm

@ 1959-60, I was bustled off with the rest of the family on an afternoon outing to see a matinee of a particular Broadway musical.
Instead of being bored and acting disruptive, I sat quietly; growing increasingly memorized by the action unfolding before me on stage.
That long ago afternoon became the foundation for my lifelong fondness for musical theatre.
I was either four or five years old.
The show was the national touring company of Flower Drum Song.
For reasons that might by now appear obvious - and despite its debatable status as far as being objectionable - it will forever remain near and dear to me.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 2:41pm

Of the prominent directors today, obviously Bartlett Sher could make it work. After all, he made “Western People Funny” work incredibly well (I think Ruthie won her Tony in part because of how funny she was in that song). But let’s get an Asian American director to get the full perspective. The score has some R&H favorites and is one of their more contemporary scores. I’d love to see a successful production.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 3:52pm

I really do enjoy the songs of Flower Drum Song even if I don't know if the material as a whole is interesting enough to compel people to buy tickets to a full-scale Broadway production at Broadway prices. The show wasn't that well-received at the time (though it still had a movie adaptation that Best Musical winner Redhead did not have) and nowadays it's considered a middling Rodgers/Hammerstein work.

That said, I think a really good director can make the original book (or synthesize it with the film at least) work for today, especially if they have Asian-American talent on stage and off-stage to help guide the tone and characterizations. 

Most Asian-Americans my age or younger don't even know this show exists, and I think the ones who had the most criticisms of it were from decades ago where they were probably the most sensitive to AA portrayals on film. I do know that what I feel is that the Asian cast of the show and film have a lot to be proud of with what they gave.

I also think the original story does say something about the nation/race-based immigration policies that the U.S. adopted that excluded the Chinese and has a lot to say about Asian-American assimilation, especially during that time period. I know Hwang's approach was a lot more explicit and had an Asian-American voice but the story just didn't sound like a good or interesting one and sometimes a less knowing and a more sincere story about characters going through an actual plot and organic character development rather than be shells to just make critiques and observations does the job making the point better.

I found an interesting article by Professor Heidi Kim on Flower Drum Song and how it touched upon and made the immigration debate palatable as it happened then and how it relates to the immigration debate now:

https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/flower-drum-song-whitewashing-operation-wetback-message-1961/#!

[wonkit]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 4:33pm

Flower Drum Song was my first Broadway experience, too. And I remember it with great admiration - for a cast that included Juanita Hall, Ed Kenney, Keye Luke, Pat Suzuki (of course!), and Jack Soo. I have pulled out the now yellowed PLAYBILL, and there in the dancing ensemble are Baayork Lee and Finis Jhung. The music was lovely, lively, touching. I still think LOVE LOOK AWAY is one of the best and most noble expressions of unrequited love in American musicals. The nightclub scenes were tacky but so are the KitKat Club scenes in CABARET and the HOTBOX scenes in GUYS and DOLLS. 

After all this time, I don't remember much about the book of this musical in detail, but can someone please explain to me - without shouting or casting aspersions - what the particular issues are with this musical? The novel was written by C. Y. Lee, and I thought at the time (I was still in grade school!) that there was a lot of truth to the generational differences and the tension between "modern" life and cultural traditions. I am a part time ESL teacher with students from virtually everywhere in the world, including Asians, and they seem to be dealing with the same issues now. I do recognize that the term "wetback" is offensive but it can certainly be worked around. I am trying to understand how it is viewed now.

 

ETA: correction of nightclub references - I seem to have dropped a line somewhere...

Updated On: 3/20/18 at 04:33 PM

[Tom5]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 4:40pm

If I remember correctly there is one - and only one - white person in the entire movie. He is a disheveled mugger who robs the elderly father of his life savings. That's something.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 4:49pm

Just from my perspective, some of the "jokes" like the Aunt's grocery order which is played for laughs and the father character may tread the line from portraying an old-school Chinese father to being a caricature poking fun of what non-Asian-Americans thought of bumbling Chinese people. There's also some things with the music that kind of sound silly. However, I think at the time, there was a lot more of a movement from Asian-Americans who were sort of tired of the orientalism and being shown as exotic which FDS is sort of guilty of in parts. Some parts of the story can be seen as how adopting the American way of living is superior to that of the Chinese way. Was there that unneeded bank scene from the film in the original Broadway version?

However, now, I can see people being more open and less afraid of being portrayed as an immigrant culture still holding on to some of the old ways while also figuring out how to balance that with being American (especially the younger characters). I think any racially-based criticism of the work is going to be more sophisticated and about how it perpetuates stereotypical views of Asian women and the whole butterfly/dragon lady dichotomy as exhibited by the Mei Li/Linda Low dynamic. However, Linda Low isn't a total dragon lady and seems to really love Sammy.

I actually don't find this work to be THAT problematic in that there's clearly a respect from Rodgers/Hammerstein and I really appreciated the film version for showing Chinatown as it could have been with everybody including almost all of the extras being Asian...including in the beginning with that cop who has no trace of accent and is confused by Mei Li and her dad and Mei Li calling the Chinese food she's eating at Sammy Fong's "American cooking". I think I need to talk to more of my peers about it, but I don't mind the exoticism so much because there are a lot of people who really have never seen a place like Chinatown in the United States. I wouldn't mind having that be exposed as it really is.

I also want to say a reaction from someone whose parents immigrated to the United States (like me) or they themselves immigrated may be different than those who are like 4th-6th, etc. generation Japanese/Chinese-American. One may be more accepting at focusing on how "different" these Asians are from other Americans while the other may not like it as much. 

Updated On: 3/20/18 at 04:49 PM

[Dodge3]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 4:54pm

The problem with the original libretto is less the cultural approach and more the structure and form of it, which is disjointed and clumsily crafted - akin to the stage libretto for The Sound of Music, only much more so. Like that property, the film version of Flower Drum Song significantly improved upon the source material, creating a more streamlined and cohesive storyline, juxtaposing song placement and redistributing who sings what in certain numbers. Commercial prospects aside, the show would be at least artistically viable if the film version was used as the blue print. Even if that was possible, the real predicament in reviving this show would be finding an actress with the delicacy and charm to match what Miyoshi Umeki pulled off as Mei Li. The balance she strikes in the film is absolutely extraordinary - always endearing, never precious. It’s actually a far more skilled performance than her Oscar-winning one in Sayonara (1957).

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 4:59pm

If they were to revive it, I also would prefer that they adopt the film's story structure and song order.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 5:03pm

For what it's worth, I saw the revised version at American Musical Theatre of San Jose (their last production, I believe) with a primarily Asian American group of friends, and most of us were Chinese American. We enjoyed it. I can't remember anything particularly making me cringe, although I'm not sure I can guarantee that I'd have the same reaction now.

[oh-bwayhereicome]

Posted: 3/20/18 at 8:19pm

As someone who is of Chinese descent and the grandson of Chinese immigrants, I find the original book much less offensive then the new version. Obviously, jokes need to be altered here and there and some of the characters need to be more fully developed beyond caricatures (mostly the father). But overall, the story is pretty good representation of the what my mother went through being first generation born Chinese in America and the culture clash with her parents. Meanwhile, the updated version is very stereotypical in such a different way that I find worse: dancing take out boxes, Club Chop Suey? Ugh, I would like to think my ethnicity on Broadway would go beyond a Chinese restaurant menu.

Updated On: 3/20/18 at 08:19 PM

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 3/21/18 at 12:32am

This thread is just giving me an excuse to post a clip of what I think was Miyoshi Umeki's best scene in the film:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LYnfUVM3v2E

I really fell in love with this song due to her rendition of it. Umeki really had a haunting quality to her singing that I love.