Musicals that have aged poorly with time?

[Randomlink1]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:03pm

I just want to know everyone's opinions on musicals that, while groundbreaking when they first premiered, are now kind of bland due to the changing times.

My vote is for Oklahoma. While the show was originally groundbreaking in its connection of the story and songs, and the plot points were somewhat refreshing at their time, its kind of dull now. It's hard to explain why it does, maybe because now so many musicals have their music integrated well into the story and have a much stronger story than Oklahoma, maybe it's because the plot has become somewhat cliched over time, but it hasn't aged well with time. The best description I've had of Oklahoma in today's age is that it is the personification of a tumbleweed. And yet it was so groundbreaking in its time.

[Jallenc32]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:15pm

Rent.  It may have been something once (though I think it's always been badly directed and poorly written).  Try and get through a production now without knowing it's place in the cannon and it is very painful.

[Mr. Nowack]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:19pm

Agree re: certain aspects of RENT (the lines with "illin' " are indeed painful). 

Give it two or 20 years and the hip modern language of HAMILTON will be painful as well.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:21pm

Agree re Rent

 

No comment on your second choice.

[Jallenc32]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:23pm

I cannot hear "I'll call.  I hate the fall" without wincing.  All of Act 2 is horrendous "it's a holiday so we'll sing a song based on what's going on in a character's life on that holiday" narration.  I think it has some great music and even some great lyrics, but Larson needed a book writer.  Add the overly stylistic direction from Michael Grief that's at odds with the supposedly gritty libretto and the whole show just comes across as a pretentious mess.

 

Again, I think there's a lot of good in there.  And had Larson not died and had a strong collaborator it could have been worthy of its acclaim.  But he didn't, and it isn't.

[Fantod]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:25pm

Oklahoma is fantastic because it's well constructed and has a great score. I'd agree with Rent. Really anything that was "of the time" when it came out.

[imeldasturn]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:29pm

Rent, Avenue Q

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:30pm

ANNIE GET YOUR GUN would have a place on this list, since when performed now it has to be edited as not to offend people who aren't capable of understanding or wanting to understand things being written in another time. 

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:42pm

Am I the only one who still loves Rent? It's one of my favorite cast albums ever. Shame about the movie, though.

I also adore A Chorus Line, but it feels very much like a period piece.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:46pm

The Chorus show is fine. It is the abomination of a movie that has not aged well starting with the day it was released.

[Mr. Nowack]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:47pm

I still love RENT, but to deny its flaws is foolish.

A CHORUS LINE on stage is endearingly of its time, on film it is garishly so.

[Borstalboy]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:48pm

I'm afraid I would have to say most of them. 

[Randomlink1]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 5:48pm

imeldasturn said: "Rent, Avenue Q

 

"

 

Actually, Avenue Q has some weird moments, but other than it's fine. I think in the future it's in danger of becoming very dated, but right now it's fine. Mixtape is kind of dated, and the "George Bush" line is somewhat dated (though I must point out that most productions update the lines to modern time. For instance, when I saw the Off-Broadway production recently, they changed it to "Donald Trump", but other than that the show's tales of struggles with sexuality and struggling to find some meaning in life will always be relevant. And yes, The Internet is for Porn seems that it will become dated soon, but keep in mind that pornography has been used in a variety in mediums, dating back to the original printing press in the renaissance. But I can see how some things in it can become somewhat dated, or at least it's not as shocking as it was originally(that being said it still is a very poignant comedy).

 

[TFMH18]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 6:28pm

On the Town. My god did I have a terrible time stomaching its views on women. 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 6:38pm

why do threads like this that could actually contain an interesting conversation immediately devolve into a listing of shows that people didn't like the first time around? That renders the question meaningless. 

[Jarethan]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 6:38pm

Absolutely the first thing that came to my mind was Oklahoma, which is painful to watch as far as I am concerned.  There is no close second.

 

Others that come to mind:

-- Company...not the score, the show

-- Little Me

-- How To Succeed...I assume this is the case...how else could it have won the Pulitzer Prize?

-- Bells are Ringing...I would love to see a good revival of this, but changes would be required, e.g., eliminate the Beatnik stuff.  You could keep the Susanswerphone...it would just reflect a certain time

-- The Wiz...I think the NBC production proved that...may be a minority opinion

 

I don't think A Chorus Line has dated...I just don't think it was as good as people originally thought it was.

 

 

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 6:44pm

I actually disagree with RENT aging poorly, A lot of the situations and stereotypes in the plot still relevant in this day in age...It's defiently one of the most grand breaking musicals of the past 20 years.

 

One musical that I think could be aging poorly is Chess from the complex Cold War plot.I would love to see it revived but thd book/plot might be too outdated .I know one of the reasons why the original Broadway production closed prematurely was because of poor reviews of the rewritten book......It's a shame because I think it has one of the best scores in musical theater history....

Updated On: 3/27/16 at 06:44 PM

[Jarethan]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 6:58pm

I saw a production of Chess at the Signature Theatre in Virginia 4 or 5 years ago...it was the best version I have seen, and did not seem dated at all.  Just because it was about something that no longer exists does not make it dated.  

[icecreambenjamin]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 7:05pm

I think some people need to understand the difference between a show aging poorly and a show being a period piece.

 Company is a period piece and I would hardly say that it has "aged poorly."  

The original production of Les Miserables, on the other hand, is horribly dated and borderline campy.

 Rent hasn't aged poorly, but is heavily flawed.  Had Larson not tragically passed away so early in the shows life, it would probably be tighter and possibly not have that bizarre false death ending.  

Chess is a musical that we may not see on broadway ever again.  It's a nice score, but it's very much so a product of the 80's and I don't think it would hold up very well now.

[The Other One]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 7:10pm

"-- Company...not the score, the show"

 

Yes, this would be my choice.  I saw the original production (sans Dean Jones and Merle Louise) when I was very young and for years I thought of it as bright, witty and oh-so-New York.  A listen to the score never failed to put a smile on my face.

 

But both the Avery Fisher concert and the John Doyle revival revealed that its always flimsy book has not stood the test of time.  What was chic and trendy in 1970 seems awfully shallow and unfunny now.  More than that, it doesn't build dramatically at all, allowing the score to do all the work.  I did not care for Doyle's approach and probably wouldn't have under any circumstances (when a show's chief asset is its score, the score must be orchestrated and sung to its best advantage which simply can not happen when singers are struggling to play instruments), but the larger problem lay with George Furth's book.  The original cast, Harold Prince, Michael Bennett, Boris Aronson and most of all Stephen Sondheim masked a lot.

 

"Hair" seems to have a similarly threadbare book, but its score works beautifully within it and builds towards a moving and powerful climax.  I would never have guessed back then that "Company" would be the one of the two to date.

[MannPhan24601]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 7:13pm

Jarethan said: "I saw a production of Chess at the Signature Theatre in Virginia 4 or 5 years ago...it was the best version I have seen, and did not seem dated at all.  Just because it was about something that no longer exists does not make it dated.  

 

You made a good point.I heard great things about the Signature Theatre production. I know that Michael Bennett who was originally supposed to direct the original Londoj production imagined it to have technological aspects including monitors and a titling floor but plans fell through when he passed away then Trevor Nunn took over. I would love to see a new Broadway/West End production with similar aspects with some of the advancements the RAH concert had but I'm not sure if that will ever happen.I know there was a rumored Broadway revival starring Josh Groban at one time...

"

 

[aaaaaa15]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 7:17pm

Yes, Rent definitely has its flaws but I wouldn't necessarily say it has aged horribly. There are plenty of young people that have discovered Rent within the last ten years or so and love it. Of course, the subject matter was more relevant at the time but I think the overall themes will always appeal.

I think its flaws are clearly there but not necessarily associated with how it has aged. They have always been there because - as has been noted - Jonathan died and they didn't want to change his work too heavily. Who knows how different it would have been if they had used the preview/off-broadway period as a show like Next to Normal did. It would have likely turned out much better.

[Alex10]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 7:36pm

I would add Carousel to this list. I think its views on and treatment of women- especially with regards to Billy being "forgiven" for hitting Julie and Louise- really won't sit well with a modern audience.

[aaaaaa15]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 8:12pm

Alex10 said: "I would add Carousel to this list. I think its views on and treatment of women- especially with regards to Billy being "forgiven" for hitting Julie and Louise- really won't sit well with a modern audience."

I agree along with Kiss Me Kate for the same reason, although I realize some people debate as to whether it is tongue in cheek or not in the latter.

[Mr Roxy]

Posted: 3/27/16 at 8:15pm

You can say all the classics have not aged well since we now live in  the age of every one getting their nose out of joint for the slightest perceived slight.