Stephen Schwartz
Stephen Schwartz
#1Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 11:53am
Since Stephen Schwartz is winning his first Tony at this years ceremony, I was wondering what everyone thinks of his catalogue of work, the big one's being Godspell, Pippin and Wicked (all which have been on Broadway in the last few years). Schwartz has always had some bad blood with the Tony's after not winning for Wicked, so it'll be interesting to see him accept this award.
I think he was definitely 2nd in line to win Score for Wicked, so feel free to discuss his body of work and/or Tony losses!
#2Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 12:03pm
Wicked has gotten many young people (myself included, admittedly) interested in theatre. Regardless of how one feels about the show, it's still a good introduction to newcomers and has made a nice, big staple on Broadway in its own right.
"Was uns befreit, das muss stärker sein als wir es sind." -Tanz der Vampire
#2Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 12:06pm
I've always been torn on the subject of Stephen Schwartz. I've enjoyed some of his work. His lyrics are usually lazy (most of Wicked, for example; and in Godspell: crucial/bushel, hill/well). The lyrics he wrote to Pocahontas are his best work, in my opinion.
"Contentment, it seems, simply happens. It appears accompanied by no bravos and no tears."
#3Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 12:08pm
The best score category is for music and lyrics written for the stage and as long as he writes his own lyrics he'll never win.
He fairs better with lyrics when someone else writes the music like Hunchback for example, but when he does both we get "bridges you never knew you crossed until you crossed."
#4Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 12:51pm
"The best score category is for music and lyrics written for the stage and as long as he writes his own lyrics he'll never win.
He fairs better with lyrics when someone else writes the music like Hunchback for example, but when he does both we get "bridges you never knew you crossed until you crossed.""
"Fiyero! Eleka nahmen nahmen Ah tum ah tum eleka nahmen Eleka nahmen nahmen
Ah tum ah tum eleka nahmen"
Lol love this song.
#5Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 12:54pm
"He fairs better with lyrics when someone else writes the music like Hunchback for example, but when he does both we get "bridges you never knew you crossed until you crossed.""
I say literally the same thing about his lyric-writing. His best song (writing both lyrics and music) is probably Meadowlark.
"Contentment, it seems, simply happens. It appears accompanied by no bravos and no tears."
#6Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 1:12pm
I met him last night at Murder for Two at the Geffen Playhouse here in L.A. He's really nice. We had a quick conversation before the show.
#7Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 2:09pm
I find it interesting that his lyrics should be simultaneously "lazy" (as gypsy101 puts it) and overly clever: "especially great communicators" and "pop-u-ler, uh, lar", the latter getting a cheap laugh but forcing the actress who plays Galinda to step out of character and acknowledge she is singing a song.
Nowhere is that more true than THE MAGIC SHOW ("Karen Horney" reference, anyone?), which makes for a largely irrelevant score on stage (and no wonder, since not much dramatic is happening on stage) though I quite like it as a recording in its own right. How I wish it were still in print!
In fact, I find that I rather like all his OCRs, especially THE BAKER'S WIFE, which doesn't have a weak song on the original, American recording. Certainly Schwartz' work wears better than Lloyd Webber's!
It's way past time Schwartz got a Tony for something...
Updated On: 5/30/15 at 02:09 PM
#8Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 2:32pm
Wicked is no doubt his masterpeice. Pippin's music is good, and Godspell's is not particularly interesting. I do love Meadowlark, but have not heard the rest of Baker's Wife (or if I did it did not make an impression). But he really took it to the next level with Wicked. I know many of you will disagree with me, but I believe that Defying Gravity is the best song ever written for the theatre (or in general for that matter). Feel free to disagree, but that's just me.
#9Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 2:35pm
"Wicked is no doubt his masterpeice. Pippin's music is good, and Godspell's is not particularly interesting. I do love Meadowlark, but have not heard the rest of Baker's Wife (or if I did it did not make an impression). But he really took it to the next level with Wicked. I know many of you will disagree with me, but I believe that Defying Gravity is the best song ever written for the theatre (or in general for that matter). Feel free to disagree, but that's just me."
I whole-heartedly think that Defying Gravity is one of the best musical theatre songs of all time, too. The build-up to the "So if you care to find me..." never ceases to give me chills. It's iconic. I saw it on Bway for the first time in March, and after Defying Gravity I stood and clapped and like no one else did and everyone just got up for intermission lol.
Updated On: 5/30/15 at 02:35 PM#10Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 2:44pm
^^^ Just as it was when the Gershwins wrote it in 1930 as "I Got Rhythm".
I like "Defying Gravity", too, but it what it is. (No, I don't mean Schwartz is guilty of literal copyright infringement. I'm just saying the Gershwins and Merman got there first in terms of the feeling and impact of the song.)
#11Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 2:52pm
When I was in the closet and heard Elphaba say "And no Wizard that there is or was, is ever going to bring MEE DOWN" made me cry my ass off. Her dad hates her (me too), she's always discriminated towards (judged all the time for being "feminine") and she basically says how she doesn't care anymore. Defying Gravity is my favorite theatre song of all time. It might not be Sondheim (who people claim to be the best) but to me.. those lyrics have got me through depression. I love Stephen Schwartz.
#12Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 3:00pm
That all makes sense to me, Jose, and requires no apology. I'm glad the song touched you so personally.
P.S. My father died two weeks ago. I hadn't heard from him in 23 years. His loss.
#13Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 3:03pm
"I whole-heartedly think that Defying Gravity is one of the best musical theatre songs of all time, too. The build-up to the "So if you care to find me..." never ceases to give me chills. It's iconic. I saw it on Bway for the first time in March, and after Defying Gravity I stood and clapped and like no one else did and everyone just got up for intermission lol."
Thank you! The buildup to the climax of the song where flies really is unlike anything else in the world! I've never felt quite that way before about a show.
#14Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 9:35pm
Frankly I've always found Schwartz's best lyrics were for the little seen RAGS. The show didn't quite work in the flesh, I'm sorry to report, but song after song has beautifully honed words-- not a false rhyme in the whole score as far as I can remember.
I never understood why he settled for such substandard words when matching them to his own notes.
And for Gaveston, so sorry for you. Not for your loss 2 week ago, but for the one 23 years before that.
Updated On: 5/30/15 at 09:35 PM
#15Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 10:53pm
Thanks, Someone. I'd only seen him four times in the 20 years before the last time, so it wasn't much of a change. That was probably TMI for a Schwartz thread, but I didn't mean to be a downer. I meant to assure Jose one can live a full and happy life without Dad's approval.
I need to check out RAGS. I barely know it.
#16Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/30/15 at 11:33pm
I'm a fan of Wicked and Godspell.
"All the Live Long Day" from Working is an important song to me personally. He wrote the music, and the lyrics that Walk Whitman didn't.
Recently I saw him in concert with Boston Gay Men's Chorus. He sang "Forgiveness's Embrace" (which I'd never heard before) and it was inexplicably touching. Some of the lyrics would be saccharine written out -- for example, the title! -- but when he sang it, it was just plain moving and direct; it didn't feel cheesy. It felt simple and deep, IMO. I even bought the CD that song is on.
#17Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 1:14am
To be fair, the "I Got Rhythm" changes are one of the Four Essential Variations in western popular music- Rhythm changes, Pachelbel changes, Doo-Wop changes and Blues changes.
#18Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 2:30am
I am also in the minority here,(except with the public). I feel that the lyrics in Wicked are extraordinarily perceptive and almost impossibly cute. And in this case "cute" not only works, it created a generation of Broadway fans. I don't feel that they are lazy at all. The first time I heard The Wizard and I, I felt it fleshed out a character as well as any song I had ever heard. I agree with JoseLee about that song.
And I like the melodies as well. I loved Ave Q but I don't find the score nearly as creative or diverse. I have practically memorized Wicked.
#19Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 2:45am
The best score that season was Caroline, or Change.
"Sticks and stones, sister. Here, have a Valium." - Patti LuPone, a Memoir
#20Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 3:38am
He's really a great theater composer/lyricist. He's never been a prestige writer nor has he ever claimed to be (well maybe CHILDREN OF EDEN) and his greatest success has been through his infectious pop flavored scores. What's so bad about that?
And WICKED really is a great show. Just saw it again recently and I was once again astounded at how good it really is. The power ballads, the dramatic irony the soaring act finale; how can you beat it. "Defying Gravity" is a powerhouse in itself.
Keeping BroadwayWorld Illustrated
#21Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 6:58am
I met Mr. and Mrs. Schwartz briefly in San Francisco. They were both really nice.
While I love the music and lyrics of Wicked, I really hate the story. I really wish it resembled the novel in some way, other than the character names.
#22Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 7:17am
"I'm Not That Girl" is perhaps my favorite song in the whole WICKED score, a perfect melody wedded to a superb idea for a song. So simple and unflashy. Would that more of his writing in the show felt like that.
#23Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 7:24am
Thanks for sharing Jose and Gaveston, those are sad issues. Wicked, brought me back to musical theater in a big way, it brought a nascent feeling of watching musicals on television with my Dad. Since that first touring company came down here to do it, going to NY and musical theater has become my only vacation choice.
Stephanatic
Dave19
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/23/11
#24Stephen Schwartz
Posted: 5/31/15 at 7:51am
I don't like the Wicked score. I feel that most of the songs are too uninspired and easy. It's like they consist of "disconnected elements". Sometimes a sentence stops, and continues in a far fetched direction, melody wise. It is not nearly as bad as for example Sondheim, but I still don't really like it.
The only song that I find acceptable is "I'm not that girl", because for some reason it feels kind fo truthful. As contrast, Defying Gravity is a product of "trapping frills" to me. A lot of bombastic standard superficiality (now we need a note like this, now we need the ensemble reecho the same word multiple times, and of course with a moment rest before the last time etc, like a parody on musical in a way).
But even "I'm not that girl" isn't very well written, it starts out nicely, but melody wise it doesn't go anywhere. When the "I'm not that girl" sentence comes, I'm always like, that was it? Just when it sounded like it was building up to something, melody wise?
I prefer composers like Elton John (For example "I know the truth" from Aida, or "Crimson Kiss" from Lestat) Songs with a very emotional scheme of building up, chords and rising of notes that give you an eargasm because of the perfect intention, then a bridge that compliments the verse, then a glorious refrain, and then he seals it with a bow, like a beautiful package, before the second verse starts......
I have thought about this a lot lately, mainly because of the Disney classics. For example "A whole new world" is a great song in my opinion, musically interesting. While "Let it go" feels just bombastic and superficial, almost like a parody on good Disney music. Uninspired.
Updated On: 5/31/15 at 07:51 AM
