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Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
#1Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:10pm
I was just watching the DVD. I hadn't seen it for a while, but something has always bothered me. The second act just seems so thrown together. And then him being George Senior reincarnate just seems a bit odd to me. I also find the music in the second act to be not as good as that of the first.
Anyone else have thoughts on this?
If you don't mind taking it as it turns out, it's a fine, fine LIFE!
Updated On: 8/31/12 at 02:10 PM
#2Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:21pmI can understand these criticisms but Sunday is my favorite show of all time.
#2Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:23pmOh I most definitely love it. I just notice that I love the first half over the second.
If you don't mind taking it as it turns out, it's a fine, fine LIFE!
#3Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:24pmyours is a commonly held belief, at least regarding the structure. Many would disagree about the music though.
Art has a double face, of expression and illusion.
#4Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:24pmI love the second act. I find it much more emotionally satisfying than act 1.
#5Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:33pmPeople can disagree about the music. This should be an open forum. I like the music in the second act when just listening to it. But once the second act dialogue is combined with it, I don't think it is as good as Act I.
If you don't mind taking it as it turns out, it's a fine, fine LIFE!
#6Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:51pmI realize the second act is flawed, but that doesn't deter my love for it, so I agree with ChenoKahn wholeheartedly. it definitely packs and emotional wallop as well. I think him being a reincarnate of George is incredibly creative in my opinion, and puts the show on a whole other level of emotion that isn't easily achieved. thats just my opinion.
#7Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 2:57pmIt's a great concept, but it just always seemed underdeveloped to me. I know it won the pulitzer and all that, and it's probably one of his best scores. I love the overall sound and the transitions are both visually and musically stunning.
If you don't mind taking it as it turns out, it's a fine, fine LIFE!
dramamama611
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/4/07
#8Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 3:30pm
I think the hard part about Act II, is that the audience is unprepared for it, and perhaps, left muddling before the connection is made.
That being said, I adore this show. One of my all time favorites. It hits a deep emotional place for me, both about creation, art and finding your purpose and inspiration in life.
If we're not having fun, then why are we doing it?
These are DISCUSSION boards, not mutual admiration boards. Discussion only occurs when we are willing to hear what others are thinking, regardless of whether it is alignment to our own thoughts.
Jon
Broadway Legend Joined: 2/20/04
#9Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 3:32pmWhether seeing it live or watching the video of the original, I always find it difficult to stay awake through the "Children and Art" scene.
#10Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 5:14pm
I'm not fond of that one either. The music in the second act is definitely good, but I just find it to be stronger in the first. Of course I love Moving On, and though I've liked other arrangments of Putting it Together, I don't really like the original as much.
The overall melodic theme of the show is the prettiest I've ever heard.
If you don't mind taking it as it turns out, it's a fine, fine LIFE!
#11Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 5:17pmBoth acts are beautiful to me, but the second act has an entirely different dramatic spine in my opinion. The first act is not an existential play, the second act is. I think that's jarring, and there are things that are not quite understandable about it except through emotion, but I absolutely love this show.
#12Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 6:23pmI'm a wholehearted fan of Sunday Act II, but even I'll admit I think more could have been made of the doubling. A lot of the act two characters seem like they are supposed to mimic their act one counterparts, but they really don't, except for the Old Lady/Blair Daniels doubling: both characters are a cold but encouraging authority figure George has difficulty impressing. In the 2007 Revival, I loved that the Boatman and Dennis got double-cast, since the Boatman is by far the most reluctant and troubling of George's subjects and Dennis is the only one in act two who refuses to continue to feed George's commercialism. I think the scene could be made a little more interesting if the traditional doubling is switched up a bit; for example doubling the Celestes and the Soldier with Betty, Naomi and Alex so when the three characters get caught up in an argument during "Putting it together" their bickering mimics the act one characters, or doubling Franz and Billy so that in both acts he is romancing the Nurse/Harriet.
#13Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 6:40pm
I admit that some of the doubling doesn't seem very well thought out (but why should it be? Is it actually in the script as to which cast member should play which two roles?) And, I'll also admit, it does seem kinda thrown together. And yet...
The show simply wouldn't have half the emotional weight it does for me, without it. Act I has many moving moments--and yes, the Act I finale is very viscerally moving. But I find its reprise at Act II even more so--thematically it just ties everything together. I remember hearing that for a long time the workshop wasn't working, until very near the end of its public run, Sondheim wrote Lesson #8 and I believe Children and Art (though it may have been Move On), and suddenly everything seemed to click--including making Act I have even more resonance.
But as mentioned, there are still many who see it (as well as ITW's Act II which also may feel a tad structureless after how well Act I is put together--but that seems by design) as adding nothing to perfect first acts. So it's not a rare thought.
(When I was a teen, always trying to get my mom into Sondheim, she remembers I'd watch Sunday constantly, and she'd watch bits--like the opening when Bernadette's dress opens up--and find it just kinda weird and annoying, until one day she sat down and watched Act II just as it was starting, and she was floored. She then wanted to watch the whole thing together, and it's now probably her favorite Sondheim show.)
We were discussion intermissionless shows--and while Sunday could never work without one (and it would cause the audience to be very restless to sit through such a long show that changes so sharply), I do think maybe some new audiences are thrown and maybe even impatient with Act II when they return after Act I expecting something more linear and traditional--I dunno, like Georges tracking down Dot in America and reuniting (who needs art!).
#14Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 6:53pm
After the last revival I like act two much more than act one. It reminds me of Into the Woods. Act one is fun and games, but all the emotional punch is saved for act two.
I have never sobbed more uncontrollably than at the final performance of the Sunday revival from "Move On" through the end. The dialogue is so wonderful and moving. When George asks, "Dot, why did you write these words," and she responds, "They are your words George," it kills me.
When the cast sings the "Sunday Reprise" to George and they all bow to him it's so beautiful. Plus I'll never forget Evans' face as he looked into the audience saying, "White. A blank page or canvas. So many possibilities." He he gasps and smiles as if he gets the most amazing idea before the blackout. It may be the most perfect finale of any show I know.
The party scene and "Putting It Together" are pretty genius too.
Marie: Don't be in such a hurry about that pretty little chippy in Frisco.
Tony: Eh, she's a no chip!
#15Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 6:54pm
I think the score to SUNDAY is indeed gorgeous, but it is the one Sondheim work that tries my patience in every other way. So it's hard to be an artist? Who's holding the gun to your head? Go become a tailor instead.
Yes, Eric, I saw the workshop when it was only Act I: an hour-and-a-half of waiting for actors to make the Seurrat painting. The La Jolla Pageant of the Masters does the same thing in a few minutes.
I don't know what Act II added (other than a few more lovely songs and a few, genuine laughs in "Hot Up Here"), but people were heckling the chromolume (or whatever's it's called) from the balcony on opening night. Which would have been closing night were it not for Frank Rich's personal crusade to save the show and canonize Stephen Sondheim.
#16Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 6:56pm
Aside from the Georges (solo and with Dot) scenes in Act I, that act does play in some ways like Act I of Woods--it's a very tightly constructed puzzle that kinda all comes together (if not as tightly in Sunday) at the end. Act II, in both, play more like "variations on the themes of Act I", and that's why I think they really are the emotional heart of both shows.
And yes, an absolutely perfect finale. (Plus, It's Hot Out Here is comic brilliance and, IMHO, a great way to at least try to bridge the audience from Act I to II).
#17Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 7:07pm
I'm know you're right about ITW, Eric, and I feel sure you're right about SUNDAY as well in terms of the second act being the point. But my objection to Sunday's first act (either alone or in tandem with the second act) isn't that it is tightly constructed, but that it telegraphs its ending.
Perhaps that's inevitable: we see the pieces of the Seurrat painting, so of course we know that they must eventually come together. But nothing in SUNDAY ever distracts me from that fact.
With ITW, on the other hand, yes, I know how the fairy tales end, but the writing encourages me to suspend my disbelief so that I'm never sure if they will end correctly in the show's Act I.
And while I think Act II of ITW is overly long (I still think Sondheim misses Prince in terms of editing), at least it has action. What are they doing in Act II of SUNDAY but waiting to sing "Move On"?--a phrase I've been repeating since the 10-minute mark of Act I.
#18Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 7:21pm
And I'm sure you're right too 
But to argue my point... Obviously, it is different with Sunday. It is less of a puzzle, and even by the costumes you can kinda guess where people will end up in the final tableaux (not to mention obvious mentions like the one about him sketching monkeys). I don't think in this case it makes the act any less effective or hard to sit through, or even less theatrical when it still does finally come together. With ITW, while we expect a happy ending, there is more tension there.
(And yes, as much as I love it, I think ITW's second act is a bit too long).
However, in that respect they're different shows. Sunday's Act I is made up of more varied and shorter scenes than Act II, but it's hardly action packed--it's many moments. The second Act just has longer, and fewer moments. (Oh dear, I don't think I explained that compellingly at all, but I'm not sure how else to). Act II mirrors Gerorges' inability to "connect" to other people, but allows him finally to--so I think we have to see some of the repitition.
#19Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 9:14pm
Eric, it isn't you who is unclear, it is I.
My point isn't that I know they'll make the painting. I know and they do, so my expectations are fulfilled.
BUT nothing else is going on, IMO, other than smug George using his work as an excuse to be a jerk to Dot. The only interesting thing in Act I is that she finally comes to her senses and runs off with a baker (foreshadowing ITW, I suppose).
And Act II is even less.
(I'll shut up now, because I know a lot of people here love the show. And I certainly love the CD.)
Updated On: 8/31/12 at 09:14 PM
#20Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 9:55pmAnd I mean I can rationally see that, when you say it. And yet, I find the show enthralling--perhaps even more on the DVD than as a CD.
#21Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 10:03pm
When everyone sings "Forever" and bows to George - That is my favorite moment in all of musical theater. It says so much about art, respect for the artist, immortality in art, so many thing...
It makes me tear up just thinking of it.
#22Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 10:04pm
I strongly disagree that act II is worse than act 1. If you ask my interpretation, I would say that the show itself is more about George than it is about Georges Seurat. It's almost like the first act is only there to set up the second act. I would say the same about Into the Woods. the whole message of Into the Woods is lost without the second act, but it needs the first act to set it up. Also, with the exception of only a few songs in act 1, I much prefer the music in act 2.
The main themes that come across to me when I see Sunday In the Park with George is connection to family heritage (and simply connection, for that matter), the posterity of art and the idea that those two things are intertwined. Those messages all come either from act II, or the connections between act I and act II.
#23Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 10:54pm
JB, I think that's what Eric meant: that in both SUNDAY and ITW the first act's primary purpose is to set up the second act, which is the heart of each show.
In SUNDAY, I just don't like either act, despite some beautiful songs.
#24Sunday in the Park...George - ACT II
Posted: 8/31/12 at 10:59pmIf I am not mistaken, the show was not "finished" when it started previews on Broadway. Weren't the still writing tbe second act?
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