Victor Victoria and the Tonys

[A0326T]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 11:25am

almost 20 years ago I saw VictorVictoria here in a preBroadway Chicago production with Julie Andrews. I thought it was magic. I also was very fond of that song "Crazy World." I saw her again in NYC and thought she was a class act. and a glorious production. 

but someone told me that it did not get a lot of Tony love and it's sole no. for Ms Andrews... which she declined or acknowledged. what happened then? I was young then and never followed theater news. .. thank you.

[jimmycurry01]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 11:36am

The nominates didn't care for the show. Julie felt she got nominated because of who she is and not for the performance she gave. She was proud of her work and of the work done by her supporting cast and creatives. Because if this, she chose to not accept the nonination. She gave a wonderful press statement at the time explaining her feelings.

I love the movie Victor/Victoria, but in truth the stage adaptation seemed overlong and dull to me. Still, kudos to her for standing up for her beliefs.

[A0326T]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 11:41am

thank you very much. I appreciate her even more after your reply.  I did not see the film it was adapted from but i put it on my list to see. thanks again.

Posted: 6/19/17 at 2:07pm

Andrews referenced the "egregiously overlooked" cast & crew in her infamous press statement.  I tend to agree.  LOVE the stage version of Victor/Victoria.  Most especially "Louis Says" & Gregory Jbara's performance as Squash Bernstein. 

[castlestreet]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 2:13pm

The show had its flaws for certain, but at the end of the day I still feel like it was an old fashioned book musical comedy.  I loved it, and the movie-which I feel were great in their own rights.  The year it opened, both it and BIG (the other show that was expected to do big things on Broadway and didn't) were eclipsed by RENT.  

[CallMeAl2]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 2:20pm

Definitely see the Blake Edwards film - it is rare 1980's original film musical, and it is really good.

Sometimes on Broadway timing is everything, and bad timing can kill shows that otherwise might run for a couple of years. The 1995-1996 season was dominated by Jonathon Larson's Rent. That Hamilton-like hit with it's edgy score and subject matter made a lot of other shows look rather anemic and old-fashioned in comparison. That impact was felt not just by Victor/Victoria, but also Big and State Fair which were also not nominated that year. In retrospect it seems hard to argue why Chronicle of a Death Foretold and Swinging on a Star were nominated, and the other shows weren't. 

In any event, none of those shows were going to topple Rent as a favorite in most categories, though Andrews certainly had a good shot besting Donna Murphy from The King and I who won Best Actress that year.

If Andrews and Victoria had come in a year earlier they could have cleaned up the Tony's against Sunset Boulevard and Smokey Joe's Cafe (the only two nominees that year). But instead they took their time out of town to avoid competing against the potential Andrew Lloyd Webber juggernaut. Of course, hindsight is 20/20 and now we know that Sunset didn't really catch fire in 1995, but a small New York Theater Workshop show no one had their eye on did. That's show biz.

Updated On: 6/19/17 at 02:20 PM

[A0326T]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 2:36pm

I'm really am thankful and feeling I'm not alone in appreciating theater because of this message board.  Before I only went to see a show,  had a grand time, a few drinks, home and sleep.  Did not think much about the show any more.  But now I feel I gained and gaining new people who love, breathe, eat theater, as friends.  If I only could go back and relive all those moments. Yes I saw BIG the musical and the movie ... and it was just ok.  I will be visiting NYC first week of August and will see shows: Groundhog, Dolly, Saigon, Bronx, Comet,  Bandstand and Beautiful. Mon to Sat. Hope I survive this!

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 3:04pm

Here is a clip of Julie after a performance of VICTOR/VICTORIA declining her Best Actress in a Musical nomination.   The remarks of Sharon Channing are quite poignant.   

https://youtu.be/-WZ-q88WhWE

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 3:06pm

Julie felt she got nominated because of who she is and not for the performance she gave.

I felt the same and did not think she deserved the nomination, but there really weren't many other choices other than perhaps Andrea McArdle for State Fair or maybe someone from Chronicle of a Death Foretold or Swinging on a Star (did anyone actually see either?).  When I first saw the show, Julie's performance seriously lacked energy and she was completely swallowed up by the production, though admittedly, it could have been due to her voice issues.  I actually preferred Liza in the role (even though they chose to cut my favorite number, Louis Says, at that point).  I did think Rachel York deserved a nomination and probably for Scenic Design (though at the time, the design awards had not yet been split into separate play/musical categories).

Sometimes on Broadway timing is everything, and bad timing can kill shows that otherwise might run for a couple of years.

Well, the show did run almost two years and played nearly a year after Rent opened.  But prior to the Tonys, the show was already experiencing controversy with Julie's voice, which led to spotty attendance and almost a month of vacation while Liza covered the role, and then the nomination fiasco.  Raquel Welch was the final nail in the coffin and I was a bit shocked they asked her to tour.  Honestly, I felt the score was really weak and outside a couple of production numbers, the rest was either forgettable or should be forgotten.  However, in all the usual bitchings and lamentations regarding film-to-stage transfers of musicals, it's interesting that this production is usually forgotten and rarely ever mentioned.  I actually enjoyed the Broadway production of Big much more than Victor/Victoria.

[Theatricality]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 3:07pm

Updated On: 6/19/17 at 03:07 PM

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 3:14pm

As I mentioned above, Sharon Channing's remarks: poignant.  

[Musicaldudepeter]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 3:16pm

Was Julie's name still on the voting ballots for the Tonys that year. In other words, was Donna Murphy going to win anyway? This Julie/Donna Tony year is as baffling and hazy a topic as the whole why-wasn't-Bernadette-nominated-for-Into-the-Woods debacle. 

[Jarethan]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 4:07pm

CallMeAl2 said: "Definitely see the Blake Edwards film - it is rare 1980's original film musical, and it is really good.

Sometimes on Broadway timing is everything, and bad timing can kill shows that otherwise might run for a couple of years. The 1995-1996 season was dominated by Jonathon Larson's Rent. That Hamilton-like hit with it's edgy score and subject matter made a lot of other shows look rather anemic and old-fashioned in comparison. That impact was felt not just by Victor/Victoria, but also Big and State Fair which were also not nominated that year. In retrospect it seems hard to argue why Chronicle of a Death Foretold and Swinging on a Star were nominated, and the other shows weren't. 

In any event, none of those shows were going to topple Rent as a favorite in most categories, though Andrews certainly had a good shot besting Donna Murphy from The King and I who won Best Actress that year.

If Andrews and Victoria had come in a year earlier they could have cleaned up the Tony's against Sunset Boulevard and Smokey Joe's Cafe (the only two nominees that year). But instead they took their time out of town to avoid competing against the potential Andrew Lloyd Webber juggernaut. Of course, hindsight is 20/20 and now we know that Sunset didn't really catch fire in 1995, but a small New York Theater Workshop show no one had their eye on did. That's show biz.

 

You declare the theoretical annihilation of SB as a non-brainer, which is ludicrous.  And in what categories do you think they would have cleaned up the Tonys?  

-- JA was certainly not going to beat GC for best actress.  GC gave a legendary performance.  JA gave as good a perf as she could with the music and direction she had to work with.  Even in its desire to give her a competitive award, the Tony voters would not have ignored GC.

-- Was someone going to beat George Hearn?  Jbara was very good, but not that good.

-- And the thoroughly mediocre score and book of VV (remember, anything from the movie was essentially ineligible) was really going to beat SB?  Come on.  Maybe SB would not have won musical and music in a number of years, but it was still light years above VV in quality, entertainment value, etc.

Without JA, VV would have lasted as long as it did when Raquel Welch came in.

I actually saw a production of VV in Ogunquit two years ago.  Ogunquit puts on very good productions.  VV was just as mediocre as I remembered it to be.

 

[A0326T]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 4:22pm

When I saw VV twenty years ago I was new in the theatre and much younger.  Seeing Ms Andrews after repeated viewing of movie musicals Sound of Music and Mary Poppins. I found no fault in VV. For me it was Julie Andrews. That is what I meant for being "magical" and just perfect production. If I had known what I know now, then the magic be gone.  But seriously I enjoy so much reading about this VV and Ms Andrews. I am learning and hoping to see more magic on stage. 

[Jeffrey Karasarides]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 4:28pm

Musicaldudepeter said: "Was Julie's name still on the voting ballots for the Tonys that year. In other words, was Donna Murphy going to win anyway? This Julie/Donna Tony year is as baffling and hazy a topic as the whole why-wasn't-Bernadette-nominated-for-Into-the-Woods debacle."

Julie Andrews was still lasted as a nominee when her category was presented on the telecast, so I'm guessing yes...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhaxOw1_JB8

[Musicaldudepeter]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 4:57pm

So obviously she was still legitimately in with a shot to win? Why didn't she, then? Backlash because of her declining the nom? Strange how she didn't win regardless of all of this, given how beloved she is and overdue she was for a Tony. I would've thought if her name was still on the ballot, nothing would've stopped her winning. And Murphy only won 2 years prior for Passion, so she wasn't overdue by any stretch. Bizarre. 

[AEA AGMA SM]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 5:11pm

Musicaldudepeter said: "So obviously she was still legitimately in with a shot to win? Why didn't she, then? Backlash because of her declining the nom? Strange how she didn't win regardless of all of this, given how beloved she is and overdue she was for a Tony. I would've thought if her name was still on the ballot, nothing would've stopped her winning. And Murphy only won 2 years prior for Passion, so she wasn't overdue by any stretch. Bizarre."

 

Which just goes to show that you can't rely on good-will to overcome a not-so-stellar performance. As others have said, it was not uncommon for Julie to be exhibiting a lower energy and the vocal strain that she was already somewhat known for (Forbidden Broadway had already lampooned this a few years prior with their "I Couldn't Hit the Note" take on "I Could Have Danced All Night," and this production gave us the brilliant Donna English coughing and wheezing her way through "Crazy Girl" to the melody of "Crazy World". Donna Murphy, on the other hand, was coming off of that win for Passion just a couple years earlier and was giving a very different take on Mrs. Anna than had been seen before on Broadway. I'm not sure that Julie would have won even if she hadn't declined the nomination.

[Musicaldudepeter]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 5:40pm

I agree. King & I won Best Revival, and either Costume or Scenic Design (I can't be bothered to check), and so I'm sure many people predicted Murphy to go along for the ride too. There appeared to be a lot of love for that production as was the same with Bart Sher's 2015 revival. 

[bowtie7]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 6:12pm

The Barbara Isenberg book Making it Big:the diary of a broadway musical (about Big, another overlooked musical that year) has an account of the Tony Nomiations for best musical that year.  

Updated On: 6/19/17 at 06:12 PM

[ggersten]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 6:21pm

The stage production of Victor/Victoria was filmed.  We checked it out from the local Library....

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 6/19/17 at 6:32pm

So obviously she was still legitimately in with a shot to win? Why didn't she, then?

Because Donna Murphy was better.  I certainly thought so.  Her performance was perfection and the surprise of the season (along with the incredible Ann Duquesnay in Noise/Funk).