Elaine Stritch: "I can do [Rose] better than anyone since Merman"

[binau]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 8:10am

https://www.broadwayworld.com/article/THE-SONDHEIM-REVIEW-Presents-Elaine-Stritch-holds-forth-about-Stephen-Sondheim-and-more-20140918

TSR: Are there other Sondheim roles that you wish you had or still wish you could play?

Stritch: I would have liked to have played Mrs. Lovett. I was asked in London, but it fell through.

TSR: What about Madame Armfeldt in A Little Night Music?

Stritch: Yes, I could do that role. I could do that role now. [Editor's Note: Stritch went on to play the part on Broadway in 2010-2011, taking over for Angela Lansbury in the 2009 revival.] What's that song she sings? "Liaisons." That's a good song. And of course, I would have loved to have played Mama Rose in Gypsy. That is a part that I should have played. I can do that better than anybody since Merman. And there isn't anybody I've seen play it who even comes close to it. It's a shame.

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 8:31am

There are two women that I think were serious missed opportunities in that role. Elaine is one, Bea Arthur the other.

[ShakinBaconGirl]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 8:38am

Bea Arthur could never have sung it.

[HighFlyingAdored97]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 10:53am

Neither could Elaine...

[newintown]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 11:04am

I think Elaine could have sung it down 2 or 3 steps, but only in the 70s or 80s.

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 11:09am

The problem with Elaine Stritch is that as she grew older, she lost nuance. She would have screamed her way through "Some People" and the audience would have walked out during the first scene change. The whole point of "Rose's Turn" is that events have been building up to that moment when she just lets it all loose. Stritch couldn't have achieved that because she would have been screaming her way through the entire role.

And I question if she was really offered Mrs. Lovett. I don't think her voice could handle the legit soprano portions of the score. For example, when the notes start to climb in "Worse Pies Of London" they can't be faked. They're supposed to be "fruity" notes and who knows what Stritch would have done with them.

[ljay889]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 11:27am

I think her voice was way too hoarse in the 80s. she would have been perfect for the London production. her vocals would have been no worse than Tyne's grating sound. I think Elaine's acting would have been the selling point.

I doubt she was up for Lovett, but I can believe she was up for Hannigan in the London production of Annie.

[Patash]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 12:20pm

"I think Elaine could have sung it down 2 or 3 steps, but only in the 70s or 80s."

I think Bea Arthur could have done that then too, but only by singing it down 15 or 16 steps.

Updated On: 9/18/14 at 12:20 PM

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 12:25pm

"I can do that better than anybody since Merman. And there isn't anybody I've seen play it who even comes close to it. It's a shame."

Except Angela Lansbury who, some people believe, gave a better performance than Merman.

Updated On: 9/18/14 at 12:25 PM

[newintown]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 1:04pm

"I think Bea Arthur could have done that then too, but only by singing it down 15 or 16 steps."

In other words, in Fred Gwynne's key.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 1:10pm

Bea Arthur sings "Some People" on her Just Between Friends CD and it's perfect. It's just a little glimpse of what she could have done with the role.

[SweeneyLovett]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:01pm

Yes, Bea's Some People was quite good. I think she could have pulled it off.

I don't think anyone's sung the role in the original Merman keys since Merman. They've all had it transposed up or down depending on the performer.

With Rose, I'm more concerned with the acting. I've heard great singers who've sung the Hell out of the score, but left me cold in the acting department. It's a tough part. If you play her too harsh, you lose the audience and if you play her too soft, you lose 'em. I've seen some nail the act 1/comedy portion, but fail during the more dramatic act II section and vice versa.

[LucyEth]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:02pm

The one thing that Rose MUST have, IMHO, is sex appeal. That's how she hooks Herbie and wraps him around her little finger. She can't simply be a Mac truck, which is how so many women choose to play her. It's wrong and ultimately exhausting to an audience. I can't think of two women with less sex appeal than Elaine Stritch and Bea Arthur.

[ShakinBaconGirl]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:07pm

Personally, I think Lupone could give Merman a run for her money. From what it sounds like, Merman steamrolled through the part, where as Patti really dug down deep into the character.

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:22pm

"Patti really dug down deep into the character."

When she wasn't digging down deep into the audience. #STOPTAKINGPICTURESYOUHEARDTHEANNOUNCEMENT

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:35pm

Bea Arthur sang "Some People" in Roz Russell/Lisa Kirk's key, and did just fine. As for Elaine, I admit, I'd prefer to have seen an earlier Elaine than late in the role.

[east side story]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 4:43pm

It is in very poor taste to poke fun of the dead, but:

That woman was delusional.

[evic]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 5:59pm

She was so full of herself. If she couldn't remember lyrics to her one song Liasons, she could never remember the score to Gypsy even in her hey day when she was drunk. RIP.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 7:09pm

Almost all actors are delusional about what they can and cannot play; it's only worse with musicals because song and dance are added to the delusion.

I wouldn't want to sit through 2 hours of Stritch OR Arthur singing GYPSY.

And as for Merman v. Lansbury, Joanna Merlin (whose opinion on acting I respect above all) said, "With Merman it was chills, with Lansbury it was tears." She was praising both.



Updated On: 9/18/14 at 07:09 PM

[Gothampc]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 7:29pm

"Almost all actors are delusional about what they can and cannot play"

Yeah, but Elaine was a bit more delusional that most. Elaine excelled at playing fishwives, broads and drunks. Ladies were never her style.

But isn't it funny? I could see Elaine playing in Hello Dolly, but that was never a role she mentioned or coveted. Perhaps not ballsy enough for her? And I don't know why Sondheim let her ruin I'm Still Here. Screaming her way through that song and trying to pretend like it was her signature song.

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 7:40pm

There was an earlier discussion of this here, which can be found at https://www.broadwayworld.com/long-island/board/readmessage.php?thread=1069563&page=1

In that thread, I suggested that Stritch was perhaps getting Mrs. Lovett mixed up with Miss Hannigan. She was offered Miss Hannigan in London, but they supposedly couldn't come to terms on money, and the role ended up going to Sheila Hancock. Hancock also later played Mrs. Lovett in the first London production of Sweeney, after Patricia Routledge turned it down.

GavestonPS wrote, "And as for Merman v. Lansbury, joanna Merlin (whose opinion on acting I respect above all) said, 'With Merman it was chills, with Lansbury it was tears.' She was praising both."

Flora Roberts was quoted as saying something very like that, on page 57 of Sondheim & Co. (2nd edition). "The best way I can think of describing them is that it was goose bumps with Merman and tears with Lansbury." Perhaps you're thinking of that, or perhaps Merlin (if you heard her say it) was paraphrasing Roberts.

[GavestonPS]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 7:44pm

May I have your hat, nobodyhome? It seems it would fit me better.

You're no doubt right that it was Flora Roberts. I respect her opinion, too.

And I'm SURE this was Dan Quayle: "A mind is a terrible thing not to have one." I used to think it was a funny error.

Updated On: 9/18/14 at 07:44 PM

[nobodyhome]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 7:51pm

Oh, we all forget stuff or get a little confused from time to time. No one is perfect.

[adamgreer]

Posted: 9/18/14 at 9:00pm

She was so full of herself. If she couldn't remember lyrics to her one song Liasons, she could never remember the score to Gypsy even in her hey day when she was drunk. RIP.

Is the "RIP" supposed to negate the nasty remarks?

If you've watched any of the numerous documentaries either about or featuring Stritch, you would know that she wasn't the least bit full of herself. In fact, just the opposite. She was about as insecure as could be.

I think she would have been an incredible Rose, not because of flashy vocals (her voice is, and always was, unique and an acquired taste) but because of her acting.

Her Hannigan would have been a hoot, too. Lovett, not so much, but stranger things have happened I suppose.

I always found Stritch to be one of the most interesting actresses I've ever watched onstage. She's a character actress, for sure, but her performances were always interesting. Even in Night Music, where she did struggle with dialogue at times, she found nuances with the character that Lansbury (who was great in her own right) never did, particularly relating to the relationship between Mother and daughter. In fact, I'd rank Stritch as one of the top 5 most interesting actresses I've seen onstage, alongside Lansbury (who may very well be the finest stage actress of all time), LuPone, Christine Ebersole, and Audra. Updated On: 9/18/14 at 09:00 PM

[After Eight]

Posted: 9/19/14 at 1:07am

"From what it sounds like, Merman steamrolled through the part, "

Not so. Not at all so. I saw her do it, and Elaine Stritch was absolutely right. No one else was as good.