I'm with Snafu. You don't put your money in expecting a show to flop.
If we're not having fun, then why are we doing it?
These are DISCUSSION boards, not mutual admiration boards. Discussion only occurs when we are willing to hear what others are thinking, regardless of whether it is alignment to our own thoughts.
Allegro Mr. President All American Jennie Kean The Girl Who Came to Supper The Happiest Girl in the World Holly Golightly aka Breakfast at Tiffany's Timbuktu!
Timbuktu! was a sumptuous all black revisal of Kismet designed and directed by Geoffrey Holder with Eartha Kitt fabulous as Lalume and Melba Moore as Marsinah. It was wonderful and I never understood its mixed reviews and short run.
All American was Charles Strouse and Lee Adams' first show after Bye Bye Birdie with book by Mel Brooks and directed by Joshua Logan. Ray Bolger starred as a college professor whose engineering techniques are adopted by the football team, propelling them to a winning streak. The football players had a big locker room production number called Physical Fitness which Logan wanted them to perform in jockstraps. By the time the show opened for try-outs in conservative 1962 Boston, however, they were wearing gym shorts and football pants.
Some shows are expected to do very well and succeed but some, HOLLER IF YA HEAR ME, for example , are just expected to be flops. That would be an example of an expected flop. But some shows with a lot of hype before opening, such as ROCKY or BULLETS, were unexpected to close as soon as they did.
No, WONDERLAND did not have any potential. Wild horn shows have always flopped and this one had the disadvantage of being even more horrendous than most of his shows, though not quite as bad as BONNIE AND CLYDE.
Anything regarding shows stated by this account is an attempt to convey opinion and not fact.
Dirty Rotten Scoundrels Legally Blonde Young Frankenstein The Little Mermaid Little Shop of Horrors Thoroughly Modern Millie Rocky Horror Show Ragtime Jekyll & Hyde Victor/Victoria Sunset Boulevard Kiss of the Spider Woman Meet Me in St. Louis Jerome Robbins' Broadway Starlight Express Mystery of Edwin Drood Woman of the Year On the Twentieth Century Mack and Mabel Over Here! Gigi Follies Coco Zorba How Now Dow Jones Hallelujah, Baby! It's a Bird...It's a Plane...It's Superman! On a Clear Day, You Can See Forever Fade-Out Fade-In Little Me Mr. President Do Re Mi Wildcat Take Me Along Destry Rides Again Happy Hunting Mr. Wonderful The Golden Apple Paint Your Wagon A Tree Grows in Brooklyn Lost in the Stars Miss Liberty Allegro Street Scene St. Louis Woman Porgy and Bess
"What can you expect from a bunch of seitan worshippers?" - Reginald Tresilian
STEEL PIER -a record twelve Tony nominations - no wins. Unfortunately, it was the same season as the CHICAGO revival, and the general consensus was Old Kander & Ebb > new Kander & Ebb.
Mister Matt, KISS OF THE SPIDER WOMAN, WOMAN OF THE YEAR, and DIRTY ROTTEN SCOUNDRELS all recouped
I know that the Broadway production of Dirty Rotten Scoundrels did not fully recoup (the closing press release said they recouped 80% of their investment), and according to the info I had, neither did the others, but I'd be happy to see the verification that they did.
"What can you expect from a bunch of seitan worshippers?" - Reginald Tresilian
As I believe I've written elsewhere, when I was a kid in the 1960s, Random House used to publish librettos for hit musicals just as CBS or Columbia would release original recordings. (Ah, for the days when Broadway was the pinnacle of American performance!)
On occasion, Random House would do a large run, but the show would flop, and the company would be left with a large overrun. The extra copies would be donated to school libraries.
So my high school library was a good indication of shows that had failed to live up to expectations.
(At least the above was my understanding why a school in South Florida would have so many copies of failed musicals, but virtually no scripts for successful ones. Publishing houses other than Random may have been involved, but that was the main one. Mine was a fairly new school, so perhaps the donations were part of a "start up" gift.)
Among the published librettos I recall in the school library were:
BAKER STREET FADE OUT, FADE IN (I wish I'd stolen that one; I doubt anyone else ever read it.) IT'S A BIRD, IT'S A PLANE, IT'S SUPERMAN! TENDERLOIN THE APPLE TREE CANDIDE DO I HEAR A WALTZ? NO STRINGS ANYONE CAN WHISTLE I CAN GET IT FOR YOU WHOLESALE PAINT YOUR WAGON PIPE DREAM HAPPY HUNTING
At least that's how I remember it after 45 years. By contrast, the Fort Lauderdale public library had SIX PLAYS BY RODGERS & HAMMERSTEIN (which I read 600 times) and not much else. (In fact, there were a few "failed shows" there as well.)
Note: some of the shows listed above may not have been literal flops. They may have made a profit but simply failed to excite the expected interest from the public. The FADE OUT, FADE IN story is an epic in itself!
(ETA: most of the shows on my list already appeared on Mister Matt's more comprehensive list. I'm merely adding evidence to support to his argument.)
Your bias against Wildhorn disqualifies you from making a statement for consideration. Simply because you or others do not like his music or shows does not mean it is gospel truth. Are Europeans all idiots because they embrace his shows ?
My mind keeps wandering to the flops that ended a legendary partnership. Shows like:
THE ROTHSCHILDS (Bock & Harnick) MERRILY WE ROLL ALONG (Sondheim & Prince) BY JUPITER (Rogers & Hart) AINT BROADWAY GRAND (Styne and Broadway in general)