Printer Friendly - Since Scientology is in the news, again.....


Since Scientology is in the news again.....
Posted by thetinymagic2 2012-07-10 01:57:48


I've read numerous things over the decades, as each new "story" leaked, however, the tales of the 3 wives are really stories re: L Ron Hubbard that even Hollywood couldn't make up. The details are just fascinating. It always astounds me, that in these days of internet "knowledge", Scientologists and their minions are so obviously brainwashed, or ignorant of these FACTS. I mean - come ON. A phony "religion" was based on THIS???????

The Sara Hollister marriage is of particular heinousness.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sara_Northrup_Hollister

I also post the WIKIPEDIA pg. for Hubbard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L_ron_hubbard

If you're REALLY interested, the other wives, children are fasinating, too.



Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by SNAFU 2012-07-10 02:17:38


Oh the things Scientology has done and tried to cover up! They don't believe in psychiatry remember!http://www.lisamcpherson.org/

if this post is deleted, it is because of Scientology's influence!

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by thetinymagic2 2012-07-10 03:04:55


Yes, I remember Lisa's story, and have read numerousother equally horrific stories. Lest we forget poor John Travolta's son, etc..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc_wjp262RY
Need I say more? lol. I just LOVED Matt Lauer's body language.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1S800ilR9c4

(Ever wonder why there's hardly ONE tidbit about Tom Cruise's (young) family life on the internet)?

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by dramamama611 2012-07-10 07:59:26


Tom Cruise is a douchebag. Hard to believe once studied to become a priest. Good for Katie Holmes for (finally) getting out.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-10 20:48:07


Not so hard to believe, dramamama. Lots of closeted gay men used to try to "escape" to the priesthood, hoping it would save them from themselves.

Of course, we all know how that turned out.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by EricMontreal22 2012-07-10 21:29:38


This is a LONG read, but one I found fascinating when first published--starting from Paul Haggis (an ex Scientologist) trying to get the church to denounce their support of Prop 8. Paul Haggis vs the Church of Scientology http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/02/14/110214fa_fact_wright

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by EricMontreal22 2012-07-10 21:29:38


This is a LONG read, but one I found fascinating when first published--starting from Paul Haggis (an ex Scientologist) trying to get the church to denounce their support of Prop 8. Paul Haggis vs the Church of Scientology http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/02/14/110214fa_fact_wright

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-11 17:40:08


Thank you, Eric. I studied the church as an undergrad, but that was 30 years ago. This is the most comprehensive article on Scientology I've read since then.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by MrMidwest 2012-07-13 12:20:43


Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by MrMidwest 2012-07-13 12:22:40


Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by JerseyGirl2 2012-07-13 12:38:21


The Suppressive Person's Manual was leaked and is available online. It's a really interesting look into their brainwashing.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by MrMidwest 2012-07-13 13:52:46


Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-13 14:04:42


Okay, so last night after the Rock Center report, I went online and fell into a Scientology rabbit hole. First I watched the BBC doc, Scientology and Me

http://youtu.be/WUn37iHxNIg

Then I started watching what I guess was Scientology's retort to it.

http://youtu.be/sdIJHZmtIYo

One thing (of many) that I don't understand, is why all the confrontations with the Sceientologists, particularly Tommy Davis, sound all fake and scripted.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by EricMontreal22 2012-07-13 15:15:24


Gaveston, I'm impressed you read the whole thing. I've been fascinated with the "religion" ever since I was a teen and had a friend who for a good few years was being sucked into a local chapter here (and already spending a ton of money on them--actually I have no idea what's happened to him, but last I spoke to him he did seem to be becoming disillusioned). It really is a good, and still kinda shocking, piece and one of the best, most comprehensive articles I've read about the whole "church".

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-13 18:51:03


Eric, I actually have a great interest in religion (I was raised in a conservative evangelical household. I'm now a devout apostate.)

I used to defend Scientology, not because I approve of their methods, but because all new religions are accused of all sorts of strange behaviors and those who leave often have to justify their previous commitment by claiming they were "brain-washed" (which is actually quite difficult and rare) or otherwise coerced.

Most new movements aren't all that different from Catholicism or the Church of LDS except that they haven't been around so long and folks aren't used to them.

But the NEW YORKER article seems to document real physical and psychological abuse and coercion. I have to rethink my belief that Scientology is mostly like the Unification Church or the Hare Krishna.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Kad 2012-07-13 21:42:39


An anecdotal piece of evidence against Scientology here:

I grew up near Clearwater, Florida- a major Scientology center for whatever reason. A girl one year younger than myself in high school was a practicing Scientologist, and when she came of the age that she could advance in the church, she did.

And cut herself off of everyone she knew outside of the Church. No one could reach her, she wouldn't take calls or answer emails or texts. She later married a man who was quite older than herself, also obviously in the church.

Her all-but abandoned Facebook will still garner comments on her birthday from former friends, wishing that she was still in their lives and hadn't abandoned so many loved ones.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by FindingNamo 2012-07-14 00:59:29


Clearwater is their mecca. And they own much of the property in town. After years of living on a yacht in international waters, Hubbard eventually moved his base on land there. They've been building and fundraising and building and fundraising for their flagship venue there, The Super Powers Building. I was surprised at their lack of subtlety when I read it's where the upper level richest members will go and learn techniques that are literally super powers. At the level he's at, Tom Cruise has total control over what they call MEST. That's matter, energy, space and time for those of you who haven't dug into this organization. That's right, Tom Cruise believes he can control that.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by SNAFU 2012-07-14 05:33:56


He just can't control is soon to be ex wife though.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-14 18:17:46


Namo, I'd always heard the stories about Hubbard living on a yacht in international waters, too. But if I read the NEW YORKER article correctly, it seems he may have been living in seclusion on land somewhere in the Northwest U.S.

Did you look at Eric's link? Am I misreading what it says about Hubbard's history?

***

Kad, the shunning of non-believers is pretty common to a lot of religious and quasi-religious groups. I remember kids in high school who were sent to Synanon and then forced to shun anyone who had ever done illegal drugs (which was all of us).

Until fairly recently, it was common for Catholic women to seclude themselves in convents, basically cutting off all contact with the outside world. Some monks did the same.

So while I agree it should alarm us, your friend's cutting of all non-Scientologist ties is one of those aspects that actually makes the Church sound pretty normal.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Borstalboy 2012-07-14 18:20:40


I can't believe EST hasn't made a comeback.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-14 18:28:16


I can't believe EST hasn't made a comeback.

I think improvements to adult diapers put it out of business.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-15 01:25:46


Gaveston, I totally get what you're saying about it being like any other Church, and on the surface that's true, but once you start pulling at the thread and digging a little deeper (and mixing your metaphors) it's friggin crazy. And yeah, I totally believe ALL religion is crazy, but this is still something else. Because all the Xenu hoohah isn't even the tip of the iceberg. And none have a sacrament of Disconnection.

I can't even direct you but just start googling it on YouTube if you want to know thinks you can never unknow. It just makes me sad when I found out a celebrity is one. Jason Lee hurts most of all.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by FindingNamo 2012-07-15 01:27:39


EST became The Landmark Forum.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-15 01:36:57


A friend, or former friend of mine, did something called The Phoneix Courses, I think? It was weird how for like six months not one of us in his circle of friends uttered the word "cult."



Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-15 01:40:30


And this one makes me laugh. I can't help it. It's the way she talks, like she's Southern. I swear to god if I didn't watch the videos about the real people, I'd think I was being punked.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-15 11:36:04


Phyllis, I agree. If Eric's NEW YORKER link is even partially correct, then Scientology has gone far beyond what Christian churches have done, at least since the 18th century.

Sorry, I meant to make that clear. My only point was that the "shunning" is pretty common, especially among newer groups.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by FindingNamo 2012-07-15 11:39:22


The New York article was thoroughly vetted before publication. Long-time observers really didn't find anything new in the article, just different names of the adherents who left and the spokespeople who vilified them.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-16 14:16:10


And my point is that the "shunning" in Scientology is still different, as it is doctrine. I'm as anit-religion as they come, but even though I acknowledge that a lot churches share identifying characteristics with cults, they're not the kind of cult that Scientology is.



Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-16 17:32:29


The New York article was thoroughly vetted before publication. Long-time observers really didn't find anything new in the article, just different names of the adherents who left and the spokespeople who vilified them.

Thanks, Namo. I didn't mean to actually question the article. I merely used the conditional because I haven't personally confirmed the claims of the author. I certainly trust that you know better on this subject.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-16 17:36:53


Phyllis, I don't understand your point. "Shunning" isn't "doctrine" among the Amish? It's a very strong custom if not doctrine, strong enough to tear biological families apart. The same is true of the Unification Church and even some Orthodox Jewish groups, by all accounts I've read.

(I am asking a sincere question as to what you believe to be the difference, just in case it isn't clear from my post above.)

DISCLAIMER: I have no ties to or personal involvement with the Church of Scientology. I'm just curious, not here to defend the institution.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by Phyllis Rogers Stone 2012-07-16 17:54:14


Yes, the Amish do shun.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-16 18:55:31


As do some other groups. What seems to distinguish Scientology per the NEW YORKER article is the forceable confinement of members, including those at some of the highest ranks. (Not to mention the periodic outbursts and incidents of violence from the head of the church.)

A lot of new groups are accused of imprisoning would-be apostates, but it's often hard to tell what is physical coercion v. what is intense social pressure. But (a) Scientology isn't that new any more and (b) they seem to be jailing members in good standing, who have no intention of leaving. (Not that trying to leave justifies confinement; it's just that Scientology seems capriciously sadistic.)

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by thetinymagic2 2012-07-16 19:17:54


Imho, "shunning" is NEVER good. Anyway, I think if you re-read the link I provided on the original post re: Hubbard's bio and Sara Hollister bio, you will gather lots of "factual" info garnered from various (on WIKI,) legit journalism sources over the decades. The man was a racist, wife beater, kidnapper and more. The only diff between "Scientology news" then and now, is that, thanks to the internet, it's waaaaay harder to keep the goings on legally and otherwise, under wraps.

Oh, and let's not forget that "Oprah Guru Guy". Need I say more? Even a zillionaire like Oprah etc. is duped into promoting these dangerous idiots. Be your own "guru" COMMON SENSE. Again, imho

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2063416/Sweat-lodge-guru-sentenced-just-TWO-years-jail-people-died-ceremony.html


Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-16 22:47:44


Again, I'm not defending the practice of shunning. I just thought somebody was arguing that Scientology's shunning was worse than that of others and I was trying to understand.

As for the guy with the sweat lodge in Sedona, words fail me.

For research projects, I've tried fasting and extreme exercise and similar experiments in consciousness alteration; but nothing that was life threatening. That just strikes me as crazy.

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by thetinymagic2 2012-07-16 22:58:01


Oh, don't mind me...I'm really opinionated on certain subjects. And there have been many tragic outcomes re "cults
".
http://listverse.com/2007/09/15/top-10-cults/

Since Scientology is in the news, again.....
Posted by GavestonPS 2012-07-18 03:43:17


I don't mind you at all, tiny. Your list seems to use "body count" as a primary criterion.

Seems fair to me.